SMF developing or stagnating (was Wordpress/SMF bridge)

[MrMike]

Its SMF's job to put the eye candy out and mine to assess!

I think my Entitlement-O-Meter just went off the scale.

So your only purpose/responsibility is to "assess" or criticize, and if a given project doesn't meet your expectations then somehow it's failing you?

Show us what you've done or created so we can play too.

[Spr1te]

Mr Mike a pleasure. Appreciate your input very succinct but as you can appreciate I'm lagging behind with my responses so I'll address the following

"SMF is not pleasing to the eye all that is offered is an outdated theme"

There are lots of themes for SMF and many of them are very pleasing to the eye in my opinion. The overall designs are somewhat limited by the structure of the system, which in this case is a forum. It really can't stray too far from that because that's what it is. If you want a nicer theme or something really different, go ahead and code it. No one is stopping you.

Granted some are what I'd describe as neat but haven't been updated for yonks. One in particular that I was most fond of was Dirt Rider. System structure and theme variation is what I feel is lacking. The quality of themes these days don't compare with the one I mentioned for instance. They seem to be limited by way of imagination. Code is beautiful but unfortunately I don't possess the skill hence my reliance on designers as is the case with most.

"3 column portals or variations of same, nothing exciting and has been that way since - well a long time"

Some truth to this, but as Kindred pointed out, the vast, vast majority of sites -all sites- are two- and three-column designs. That's what seems to work and so it should come as no surprise that we see so many of them. And it should also come as no surprise that SMF uses similar layouts.

Yes that's how sites are built but the ones with appeal and I'm not talking forums - don't come as 3 column perce as is the case with SMF, they're a mixture of such and have insets, headline modules, sliders etc...they have the possibility to excite given the right mix of flexibility and imagination. That possibility doesn't seem to be evident with SMF as is and is possibly the reason why people tend to gravitate toward WP. I suggested this is an area that SMF could concentrate on to outgun WP but appears to have fallen on deaf ears. In regard to your remark "What seems to work" is that there is nothing else available in so far as SMF is concerned. They are so outdated and boringly the same in my opinion.

It's true that the pace of development of SMF (and most forum software as well) is slower than something like WP.....I'd pick a stand-alone script or maybe use a WP platform with a plugin.

As I have done, Id just like to see things get more mobile with SMF and I feel these areas we have covered are the reason for SMFs lagging popularity. An up to date chat plugin would be nice.

[Arantor]

I feel these areas we have covered are the reason for SMFs lagging popularity

Whoosh.

[Spr1te]

The new version of SMF for instance is not new, it looks the same! - currency is what I'm on about.

I don't see any reason it shouldn't look the same or similar. I prefer it that way. I don't want to have to relearn stuff every time there's a new release.

You want currency, I want consistency.

Yes but even Microsoft realizes when change is needed, it must proceed even if its users are comfortable with the way that things are. Again all linked to form and function, which in combination equates to popularity. If what you doing doesn't yield favourable results you must institute change. std

[Spr1te]

Because form follows function, of course.

Appeal to new is a standard logical fallacy, just as some here would do well to learn that appeal to antiquity is just as much of one.

All well and good if your only appealing to antiquity which is the case in point!

[Arantor]

I wasn't, but never mind.

[Kindred]

ummm.... I think you missed the entire point of his statement there (no real surprise, since you seem to miss the point of everyone who doesn't agree with you)


Appeal to new is WRONG
Appeal to antiquity is also WRONG

And you are also wrong... we are not "only appealing to antiquity"
Once again, you seem to assume that your opinion is the only correct one and that anyone who doesn't agree with you is wrong or "ignoring reality".

2.1 develops a new theme that is responsive...
I'm not a huge fan of the color scheme... but as a default theme, it is new and it is nice.

[Spr1te]

Ha ha I seem to recall making the "Form Follows Function" statement elsewhere. 

Where? I must have missed that.

My bad. Was referring to comments made on Wedge.

OK I gave mention to Mercedes Benz a few posts back making the point on user demand. Proper design takes form more seriously than you might think. Why do you think Merc design team place so much emphasis on presentation of their finished product?

(1) They care far more that it works than what it looks like.

Disagree when you go out to buy a car or  setup a website, anything for that matter > appeal has a lot to do with your selection all cars/sites work not all of them are popular!

(2) "Presentation of their finished product" has virtually nothing to do with the design and construction of the presented product.

Again, Merc concept team visualize the new product, set about creating a clay mould, revamp and refine, wind tunnel test etc then commence production phase once approved. Its all about look!

[Spr1te]

"although form follows function its a prime ingredient in the overall mix and must not for one instant be overlooked"


And now you are using doublespeak

just pointing out that not enough importance appears to be placed on this component of design. And the resistance I'm encountering is mind boggling.

so?   If you don't like it, get off your buttocks and make your own theme - then offer it on the theme site to demonstrate what you think a good theme looks like!

I believe Ive already elaborated on that > I don't possess the skills. Hence my suggestion to start a topic on WP/SMF site comparisons so you guys as well as readers could draw from that study the opposition and find out why they're successful and institute change as needed.

[Arantor]

They're successful because they do a totally different thing to SMF and therefore have a totally different market?

For example, let's compare tractors to Mercedes-Benz and see which is more successful. By your logic we should make tractors that look like Mercedes cars and they will be more successful... Or not. By comparison we could make tractor-like Mercedes cars, but that's also not going to work so well, is it?

Different tools for different jobs.

[Spr1te]

I was about to throw my arms up in despair but no, Ill continue so please bear with me and hold the abuse if you will. They say the truth hurts.

[Arantor]

It's like you just read my mind in how I feel trying to explain any of this to you.

[margarett]

This topic is about a *bridge* between SMF and WP. It went between themes comparison and now we're discussing tractors...

I'd say it's time to stop this. Points were presented, agreements were disagreed. I would hate to lock this (because the OP is totally unrelated) but...

[Spr1te]

This topic is about a *bridge* between SMF and WP. It went between themes comparison and now we're discussing tractors...

I'd say it's time to stop this. Points were presented, agreements were disagreed. I would hate to lock this (because the OP is totally unrelated) but...

Conveying some innocent feedback nothing more! > For the record it has a lot to do with the bridge the whole SMF package infact.

[MrMike]

Yes but even Microsoft realizes when change is needed

Lol, holy crap, you couldn't have picked a worse example if you tried. Microsoft has screwed up the last couple of versions of Windows so badly that people started writing 3rd party apps to restore the interface to the previous version.

Microsoft completely lost the plot and Windows 8 was roundly hated by everyone. There is almost no one who looked at Win 8 and said the changes were good. Microsoft threw out 30+ years of a well-understood and well-liked interface for no other reason than to make changes, and it was a total flop. No one asked them to change, users didn't petition Microsoft to bork the look and feel, they did it because they were stupid and didn't listen to their users, 99.9% of whom were telling them, "Don't do that!".

And the result was an epic fail. Now Microsoft is desperately backpedaling trying to reintroduce a UI that is what users have come to want and expect over the last 3 decades.

Seriously, picking Microsoft as an example of forward-thinking design philosophy was probably the worst example you could have possibly come up with. Second in line would be those f*%#ing idiots at Gnome, who destroyed a UI for no apparent reason other than "we wanted to change stuff". That was a monster fail too.

[MrMike]

Again, Merc concept team visualize the new product, set about creating a clay mould, revamp and refine, wind tunnel test etc then commence production phase once approved. Its all about look!

No, it's not all about look. If a million people asked Mercedes Benz to make a car that looked like a typewriter or a jelly donut, they wouldn't do it...because they can't. Yes, even at the Mercedes Benz factory and design groups, form follows function. It always does in any good design.

[MrMike]

I believe Ive already elaborated on that > I don't possess the skills.

Then perhaps you should refrain from criticizing those who do. It takes no skill or cleverness to find fault.

[MrMike]

I'd say it's time to stop this. Points were presented, agreements were disagreed. I would hate to lock this (because the OP is totally unrelated) but...

I would ask you to please not do that. There's no need to censor or prohibit discussion, even spirited, somewhat contentious discussion. 

[Spr1te]

Yes but even Microsoft realizes when change is needed

Lol, holy crap, you couldn't have picked a worse example

Well they're successful, in it for the dosh and doing quite nicely > They have acknowledged they were hasty and have sought to rectify. Nonetheless I would wager they're next release continues to be stylish irrespective of poor function.

[Spr1te]

Again, Merc concept team visualize the new product, set about creating a clay mould, revamp and refine, wind tunnel test etc then commence production phase once approved. Its all about look!

No, it's not all about look. If a million people asked Mercedes Benz to make a car that looked like a typewriter or a jelly donut, they wouldn't do it...because they can't. Yes, even at the Mercedes Benz factory and design groups, form follows function. It always does in any good design.

Of course it does but its a prime influence in the mix. People like candy I know I do.