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Mods and backups

Started by oroedel, April 26, 2015, 07:29:48 AM

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oroedel

I have a forum which was deleted by the host (gangster!).
I installed a new forum and used the backup I had, now I have mods in the mod list that I can install but they are still working!?

What will I do delete them in the package manager or install them (even if they are working)?
I need to update some of them. And 2.1 is coming so I will clean the forum until I have to update to 2.1.



Bob Perry of Web Presence Consulting

Quote from: oroedel on April 26, 2015, 07:29:48 AM

I have a forum which was deleted by the host (gangster!).
I installed a new forum and used the backup I had, now I have mods in the mod list that I can install but they are still working!?

What will I do delete them in the package manager or install them (even if they are working)?
I need to update some of them. And 2.1 is coming so I will clean the forum until I have to update to 2.1.


Not really a "huge" issue here, you can uninstall/n/delete them, or if you do uninstall... be sure that you go back over the code and insure that it indeed has removed every aspect of itself from your system, especially in the light of the new core release impending... leave them sit there in the package manager until you are sure you want them to get gone. Or what i do typically is leave older versions of my favorites lingering in the package manager for quite some time actually... reason being that many of the mod authors you will encounter, have problems when the mod is uninstalled, they are notorious for leaving little snippets of themselves behind even though the package manager indicates that they were removed successfully. This may sound negative toward the mod author but that is not my intention here, it is very easy to make mistakes in coding the uninstall procedures and with newer versions of the core software, new problems with uninstalling pop up that many coders don't consider important enough to fool with, especially where the language files are involved. They sometimes will sacrifice thoroughness for expediency to get the install right and not worry too much about the language files... as long as the meat of the module functions properly they will not pay much attention to the uninstall sections where the language files get to be a hassle as they have poured their heart and soul into the core execution of the meat of the mod and I'm guessing that they just don't give a crap about the tedious detail work of insuring the proper execution of the uninstall procedure? Again, not meaning to bash the coders, this process of building software has its merits, but attention to detail sometimes is lost because they have long hours invested, all night sessions poured into the meat so typically they are exhausted and hey, these guys and gals should be applauded in my opinion as I am old school and know full well how nerves get frazzled when they put a product out there for the rest of us (and usually for FREE I might add) and it always happens, some novice finds a slight oversight or bug and raises the issue to the fore rather rudely at times, (i'm guilty of that myself) it makes some them very irate indeed... that's where you separate the wheat from the chaff in coders. Some handle it better than others... anyway, back to your pose, its up to you actually, depends on the functionality you want to remain as a part of your system, if the function of the mod is redundant with the advent of the new release, why keep the mod active? Sometimes i will keep older versions just because, most of the time they get gone, depends on my mood at the time i suppose...
Best Regards,
Bob Perry



"The world is moving so fast these days that the man who says it can't be done is generally interrupted by someone doing it." Elbert Hubbard

oroedel

in fact I think it was my fault. I had to install a clean forum and import only the database, but I used the WHOLE backup (all smf files).
Now the package manager lists 3 mods that are there to install, but sure the code is still there.

So I delete them and look in ALL files the mods had changed. To delete manually the code. Right?
Cause a delete of the package manager will NOY uninstall, the pm will only delete the install files. Right?

I think the problem of the mods is HOW they work, it´s really hard to clean smf of them.
But if I understand the hook idea the new mods are easier to handle (just guessing, didn´t read about it in detail).

I coded a lot in the "good" old bbs past (yes modem time), mods for me and I distributed for free. But our bbs system was much more "intelligent" in terms of modifications. If you worked clean you never changed the original code.

Before someone of the smf team feels critisized, I know smf is a very good work and it isn´t easy do stuff for FREE.

I don´t know I´m in the mood to create code for smf, I like more beekeeping and car restauration. Just wasting to much time on the display.

Suki

There was no need to do all of the things you did.

The mods were marked as uninstalled because the DB says so, the DB is only aware of the state of a mod if the mod is installed via the packager manager.

If you decided to change the DB then the mod install log got lost, thats to be expected tough and it has nothing to do with how SMF handles mods, if you replace the DB without taking into consideration the files then for sure bad things will happen, it happens on a lot of scriptsa not only on SMF.
Disclaimer: unless otherwise stated, all my posts are personal and does not represent any views or opinions held by Simple Machines.

oroedel

Suki, I don´t want to critisize, I know it was my fault.
Just saying, there are ways to have mods without changing code files. This could limit the creativity, but also the chaos a user can make ;-)

Thanks to lurkalot, I did fix_packages;php check the situation and that´s what came out:
First image shows the result of the fix
second what I really have running, even the mods that are "not" installed are running.

What I will do?
- unhook everything that doesn´t run?
- change status of uninstalled mods that are running to installed

Is this the right way?
But why have so much mods that I only tested in this list?
I need to check out all affected php files?

Suki

It really depends on what you are trying to do.  Are are you trying to do?  keep your DB or keeping your files?  do a fresh installation without losing your content?  have a clean DB without losing the file edits the mods did?


As for ways to have mods without changing code, thats already possible but most mod authors are still unaware of it or their modifications are too specific and cannot be done via hooks.  Also, if you said you've worked on software before you will surely understand the pains of having to deal with an old codebase...
Disclaimer: unless otherwise stated, all my posts are personal and does not represent any views or opinions held by Simple Machines.

oroedel

Now I changed status from uninstalled to installed of the following mods:
- advanced language menue
- simple youtube embedder
- Like Posts 1.6

the last results in mess, I have one more 1.5 uninstalled, and now a 2.0.3 installed???

Suki

Quote from: Suki on April 26, 2015, 11:36:04 AM
It really depends on what you are trying to do.  Are are you trying to do?  keep your DB or keeping your files?  do a fresh installation without losing your content?  have a clean DB without losing the file edits the mods did?

I really, really need to know what you want to achieve in order to properly assist you.
Disclaimer: unless otherwise stated, all my posts are personal and does not represent any views or opinions held by Simple Machines.

oroedel

Quote from: Suki on April 26, 2015, 11:36:04 AM
It really depends on what you are trying to do.  Are are you trying to do?  keep your DB or keeping your files?  do a fresh installation without losing your content?  have a clean DB without losing the file edits the mods did?


As for ways to have mods without changing code, thats already possible but most mod authors are still unaware of it or their modifications are too specific and cannot be done via hooks.  Also, if you said you've worked on software before you will surely understand the pains of having to deal with an old codebase...

I understand that´s way I said I´m not critisizing...

I want to clean the forum from stuff that isn´t in use. Want to keep it ready for 2.1 and/or other updates.
I want the phantasm mods deleted from everything and the mods that are working but listed as not installed, marked as installed and if needed updated.

The forum is working, I´m just curious about this mod stuff and want to get the waste out.

Suki

So... next step is figuring out which mods aren't installed and which mods are installed.

Can you post a list of the mods that are currently installed (as in, their code actually exists on SMF files)  and those mods that are no longer installed (as in, there is no trace of their code on any SMF files).
Disclaimer: unless otherwise stated, all my posts are personal and does not represent any views or opinions held by Simple Machines.

oroedel

Quote from: Suki on April 26, 2015, 11:53:38 AM
So... next step is figuring out which mods aren't installed and which mods are installed.

Can you post a list of the mods that are currently installed (as in, their code actually exists on SMF files)  and those mods that are no longer installed (as in, there is no trace of their code on any SMF files).

That´s the list. I still used fix_packages and activated 3 mods that were listed as not installed.
The "only" strange thing is this "Like Posts" which appeared now in version 1.6 active and 2.0.3 non active.
And using fp find another 1.5 inactive.

If you take a look at the screen shots you maybe will intend better, I don´t knwo I´m explaining correctly.

Suki

It really doesn't matter if that page says X or Y mod is installed...  all that page is showing is some random value in your DB.

What really matters is is you have actual code on your files, thats why I asked you for a list of mods that actually has code added to you forum's files.

So, again, can you provide a list of mods that are actually installed on your forum, as in, (has added code to your files).


The "red" dot on the likes mod doesn't indicate its install status, it indicates that specific mod version you have is outdated and that there is a new version available at SMF.


I believe you are quite confused about how that page operates.
Disclaimer: unless otherwise stated, all my posts are personal and does not represent any views or opinions held by Simple Machines.

oroedel

Ok, I intend.
I guess all that active mods have added code to smf or not if they are hooks!?
They are working fine in the forum.

Suki

You don't have a lot of mods so what you can do is this:

- Make a back up of both DB and files.
- Grab the SMF 2.0.10 large upgrade and upload it to your forum, DON'T RUN THE UPGRADE, just upload the files to replaces all your existing files.
- Go to your admin section and check the mod list, they will still appear as installed, uninstall them, doesn't matter if there are errors as you already upload a clean set of files.

Now you have a completely clean SMF installation, just proceed to install (via the package manager) all the mods you want to keep.

I'm pretty sure there is a wiki entry for this process somewhere.  Ah here it is: http://wiki.simplemachines.org/smf/How_to_upload_a_fresh_set_of_files
Disclaimer: unless otherwise stated, all my posts are personal and does not represent any views or opinions held by Simple Machines.

oroedel

ok, that´s what I was thinking about, but hoped there would be another (easier) way :-)
Will do this on a rainy day...

Thanks for your help!

Suki

Well, thats the easy way, another not so easy way would be to manually check each mod's parser looking for all the code edits a mod does and delete/repair as you see fit.
Disclaimer: unless otherwise stated, all my posts are personal and does not represent any views or opinions held by Simple Machines.

oroedel

ok  :laugh:

Thanks for your attention, even on a sunday!

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