So some time now, I have had users deleted posts be randomly deleted within the recycling board over time. We used to have a 100+ deleted pages and now we're down to TWO PAGES. All that's left are the most recently deleted posts on one page and the next is the first deleted posts we've ever had. Has this been a previously known glitch? I haven't seen anything on this board or through search myself. Along with that, is there any fix?
Using SMF 2.0.15 currently with these packages (I have not added anything new in the six months):
1. SMF Post Prefix
2. Stop Spammer
3. Topics Created And Participated In
4. Ignore Topics
5. Yet Another Spoiler Mod
6. Custom Action Mod
7. Member Awards
8. Bookmarks
9. Avatar on Member List
10. SubAccounts Mod
11. Sneaky Editing
12. Yet Another YouTube BBCode Tag
13. Global Headers Footers
14. markItUp! for SMF
15. SMF Staff Page
16. Drafts
17. Posting Template SMFSimplee ]
18. BBCode with style
19. More Gender
20. @mention members
21. Current Signature Mod
22. Ultimate Profile
23. Custom Username Color
I'd be more inclined to check your permissions to see who can see/delete in that board.
There are no known glitches with that feature.
I had the same problem on forum where I was administrator till 2 years ago, old forum with oldest deleted topics from 2009/10, and I noticed on 1 page latest deleted and on another oldest deleted posts/topics. Try to physically remove some posts from Recycle bin and see if more from hidden deleted posts inside Recycle bin are popping up?
Still, you should be able to see deleted posts through member profile, and with every deleted post from Recycle bin you will get back hidden deleted posts/topics. Try it and let me know what happens.
I guess you want to keep posts to not reduce post count for your members. And of course, that job around Recycle bin is for administrators, so not many people should have access there because one individual can cause real damage and you won't even know about it and when you finally realize what's going on it can be 2-3 weeks since some action was done or more.
I have already went through logs. No one has deleted these posts.
Quote from: efk on May 09, 2020, 02:10:23 PM
I had the same problem on forum where I was administrator till 2 years ago, old forum with oldest deleted topics from 2009/10, and I noticed on 1 page latest deleted and on another oldest deleted posts/topics. Try to physically remove some posts from Recycle bin and see if more from hidden deleted posts inside Recycle bin are popping up?
This did occur when I was purging it earlier, strangely enough. When deleting some spam posts, other's filled it's spot .
Also it appears that these threads are hidden(?) since they do show up on the recent posts preview for the recycling bin board, but in the board itself.
Not sure if logs will catch deletion from Recycle bin, go test it and let us know, I'm too lazy to try that :D
So its exactly the same thing that happened on the forum where I was administrator. The good thing is you can still access to deleted posts/topics through any profile as admin but you will have to invest time since its manually searching for posts/topics - here I can't confirm if you can see only posts from deleted user.
Quote from: StarredSkiesAlso it appears that these threads are hidden(?) since they do show up on the recent posts preview for the recycling bin board, but in the board itself.
Appearance should be random, but on 2nd page you should see the very oldest topics from Recycle bin. If this criteria is met, then its 100% the same thing .
This might be a
bug with SMF or with some mod, but for some reason mods that you provided are not known to me - I mean I haven't used them, maybe only those I tried:
@mention members
Member Awards
But I'm not sure about Member Awards if its the same mod that I used for years.
https://www.simplemachines.org/community/index.php?board=137.0
I'm sorry, but I fail to believe you, as the stated actions contradict logic
Quote from: Kindred on May 18, 2020, 11:58:27 PM
I'm sorry, but I fail to believe you, as the stated actions contradict logic
The best way to see, understand and believe is directly on forum of topic author if he allows such testing. My first post and reply from topic author described his situation and next was my perception. The main question is what logic makes topics to lost their order by time where 2nd page shows oldest deleted topics and 1st page has completely strange behavior.
Quote from: StarredSkies on May 09, 2020, 01:02:41 AM
We used to have a 100+ deleted pages and now we're down to TWO PAGES. All that's left are the most recently deleted posts on one page and the next is the first deleted posts we've ever had.
I'm questioning this part if all latest deleted posts/topics are on the first page or they cover some part and other random date fill another half of 1st page.
What EFK is explained earlier is what I have going on. This in specific:
Quote from: efk on May 09, 2020, 02:10:23 PMI had the same problem on forum where I was administrator till 2 years ago, old forum with oldest deleted topics from 2009/10, and I noticed on 1 page latest deleted and on another oldest deleted posts/topics. Try to physically remove some posts from Recycle bin and see if more from hidden deleted posts inside Recycle bin are popping up?
Thankfully, as EFK made clear, the posts still appear in user profiles. Thank you for this information, as it relieves a lot of weight off my shoulder! Really appreciated. Even so, I would like to make sure I have a spot to see deleted posts and allow my users to not have a depleted post count. Hence why I'm asking about this apparent 'bug.'
Quote from: efk on May 19, 2020, 01:21:18 PM
The best way to see, understand and believe is directly on forum of topic author if he allows such testing. My first post and reply from topic author described his situation and next was my perception. The main question is what logic makes topics to lost their order by time where 2nd page shows oldest deleted topics and 1st page has completely strange behavior.
Along with this, why hide the threads in the middle or hide them at all? The recycling bins purpose is to be collective board of deleted threads and by having them disappear, it contradicts the purpose.
Quote from: efk on May 19, 2020, 01:21:18 PM
I'm questioning this part if all latest deleted posts/topics are on the first page or they cover some part and other random date fill another half of 1st page.
The first page is *ALL* of the the recently deleted posts. The next is our oldest threads that have been deleted, dating back to early 2018.
Additional information:More recently, a new predicament occurred. When clearing the board (see 'The Garbage Bin'), the board comes up as empty. The recent posts preview shows otherwise. Here's a GIF one of my admins made to show off what's occurring in this situation. This is from 7PM today. Earlier, around 2PM, there WAS posts in the board. This can also be seen from the mobile screenshot below. I believe this issue coincides with the hidden threads mentioned previously.
(https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/525212243403472906/712465720297914450/rip_bots.gif)
(https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/525212243403472906/712380042230890547/image0.png)
When threads do show up again, I will get an example of the hidden threads popping up when the ones previous are deleted. After all, the total wipe of the board happened yesterday too and yet they came back this morning (after I deleted rejected more spam). Needless to say, this problem is convoluted and I really hope for a fix or any clarification.
bump <3
the only real way this can happen is if someone is deleting them from forum or database, their is no way the software can do this without human intervention. Change your passwords to cpanel and database (remember run repair_settings.php to update the password) also I would suggest updating to 2.0.17 as a few bugs were fixed since 2.0.15.
Honestly I've never seen the behaviour described in the last 10 years. But I've not followed development of 2.0 since 2.0.14 so if it changed then, I guess it's possibly a bug introduced then?
I've been running a recycle board for 10 years, including up to 2.0.17 -- and i have never seen that behavior.
So, since StarredSkies and EFK are the only two people to ever have seen this, I would guess that they have to consult with each other and figure out what combination of edits ended up breaking the recycle board.
Haven't witnessed anything like this at least up to 2.0.15 - I haven't had much time to get familiar with 2.0.16 or .17 yet, but somehow I doubt it would have introduced something like this.
What I think this could possibly be, not very likely but possible, is actually a hosting issue... Either the DB is misbehaving, or the server is giving badly cached results, or a combination of these etc... ?
Quote from: Aleksi "Lex" Kilpinen on May 29, 2020, 12:17:33 PM
Haven't witnessed anything like this at least up to 2.0.15 - I haven't had much time to get familiar with 2.0.16 or .17 yet, but somehow I doubt it would have introduced something like this.
What I think this could possibly be, not very likely but possible, is actually a hosting issue... Either the DB is misbehaving, or the server is giving badly cached results, or a combination of these etc... ?
It'd be pretty bizarre if that only affects the recycle board though. :P What'd be interesting to see is whether or not they're actually gone from the database or just hidden due to a quirk in one of those many mods. I mean:
Quote
Still, you should be able to see deleted posts through member profile, and with every deleted post from Recycle bin you will get back hidden deleted posts/topics
Unless I misunderstood, that suggests they're actually still there. That behaviour, in my mind, can only occur due to a mod doing something it shouldn't be doing. Maybe like the Ignore Topics mod, but looking at its customisation page that does something else than I thought it'd do. :P In which case, it should be as simple as eliminating the mods one by one to see after the de-activation of which one the board is suddenly populated with *all* the topics again? Surely a tedious job, but then at least you'll know the cause.
What happens to the recycle bin view if the number of messages per page is altered to, say, 50 (in the theme settings)?
Thanks. I'll look into updating to 2.0.17 and testing it, seeing that I do have some older mods. I tried 2.1 but that broke a lot, but that's besides the point here.
EFK, what mods did you have installed at the time? Perhaps it's something in common causing this issue. As of right now, I'm not having problems with my host (presumably) and no new access to my CPanels. Nevertheless, I'll take a peek because these topics are
in the system but they're just hidden.
Quote from: CoreISP on May 29, 2020, 12:32:19 PM
Unless I misunderstood, that suggests they're actually still there. That behaviour, in my mind, can only occur due to a mod doing something it shouldn't be doing. Maybe like the Ignore Topics mod, but looking at its customisation page that does something else than I thought it'd do. :P In which case, it should be as simple as eliminating the mods one by one to see after the de-activation of which one the board is suddenly populated with *all* the topics again? Surely a tedious job, but then at least you'll know the cause.
You understood correctly. You are correct though, this could be correlated to the ignore topics mod.
edit// I have tested this and it is not ignore topics. Will try others.
Quote from: Shambles on May 29, 2020, 01:11:35 PM
What happens to the recycle bin view if the number of messages per page is altered to, say, 50 (in the theme settings)?
I went from 20 to 50 and it revealed the hidden topics. Here is our 20th topic:
(https://i.imgur.com/LcBZWvZ.png)
And then when I upped it to 50 in the theme settings, it revealed more of the hidden topics. Notice how there are posts underneath the 20th. (excuse the dirty spam)
(https://i.imgur.com/M4CKxGI.png)
So, as I suspected, it seems to be a pagination fault. I trust there are no errors docked in your error log, regarding this?
Yep. There are no errors docked in my error log.
Do you suffer the same pagination issue for the topics in your board indexes?
I do not, thankfully.
Do you have any mods that affect pagination?
Does the same thing happen using the default theme?
Perhaps maybe SMF Post Prefix. Tried uninstalling Ignore Topics and no luck either.
It occurs on all themes.
Please download {from your website} Sources/Subs.php and attach it to your next post.
That file declares the constructPageIndex function so it'll be interesting to see if anything in there has been altered that may affect/influence processing of the pagination specifier for the recycle board.
The best way forwards, however, would be to upgrade to the latest stable version which is currently 2.0.17 then see how you fare.
Here is my Subs.php file in full. As someone who's not very familiar with PHP, I really do appreciate the help.
I will have to continue discussing with my staff about upgrading and deciding on a date to do so.
Well, that Subs.php file looks fine to me, so do think about the upgrade as discussed.
Quote from: Arantor on May 29, 2020, 12:03:01 PM
Honestly I've never seen the behaviour described in the last 10 years. But I've not followed development of 2.0 since 2.0.14 so if it changed then, I guess it's possibly a bug introduced then?
SMF 2.0.14 Released (https://www.simplemachines.org/community/index.php?topic=553855.0) in May 2017, so it can be bug from that period because it is possible forum where I was admin got that problem around that period.
Quote from: Kindred on May 29, 2020, 12:12:54 PM
I've been running a recycle board for 10 years, including up to 2.0.17 -- and i have never seen that behavior.
So, since StarredSkies and EFK are the only two people to ever have seen this, I would guess that they have to consult with each other and figure out what combination of edits ended up breaking the recycle board.
Not part of that forum anymore, this topic was about that forum - https://www.simplemachines.org/community/index.php?topic=572178.0
I said probably about 80-90% things that I noticed about it and what was happening so unless I read something familiar that will remind me about something, hard to provide more info on it.
The most important thing you need to know about it it happened to that forum about 2-4 years ago, but I believe it came with 2.0.14 and in 2017 I had full access, can't confirm for 2016.
Quote from: Aleksi "Lex" Kilpinen on May 29, 2020, 12:17:33 PM
What I think this could possibly be, not very likely but possible, is actually a hosting issue... Either the DB is misbehaving, or the server is giving badly cached results, or a combination of these etc... ?
About this, I remember we had some problems and our coder was fixing + improving few things, so it happened after event.
Quote from: CoreISP on May 29, 2020, 12:32:19 PM
It'd be pretty bizarre if that only affects the recycle board though. :P What'd be interesting to see is whether or not they're actually gone from the database or just hidden due to a quirk in one of those many mods. I mean:
Quote
Still, you should be able to see deleted posts through member profile, and with every deleted post from Recycle bin you will get back hidden deleted posts/topics
Unless I misunderstood, that suggests they're actually still there. That behaviour, in my mind, can only occur due to a mod doing something it shouldn't be doing. Maybe like the Ignore Topics mod, but looking at its customisation page that does something else than I thought it'd do. :P In which case, it should be as simple as eliminating the mods one by one to see after the de-activation of which one the board is suddenly populated with *all* the topics again? Surely a tedious job, but then at least you'll know the cause.
From the list StarredSkies provided up mutual mods we had are Member Awards for sure and maybe @mention members but we got it around that time or after problem occurred so this could be connection. Recycle bin behavior was not always the same.
Its not real to give you a list from that time since I don't have access there for about a year and at that time I added 15-20 mods, but I can list some we had for sure, no idea which mods came later to the forum:
Global Topics
SimplePortal
Log Karma Actions
Post History
SMF Gallery Lite
Countdown BBCode
FancyBox 4 SMF
PartyMembers
Spoiler BBCode
@mention members
InfoBox
Separate the sticky topics
Country Flags
Last Active On MemberList
NiceTooltips
Simple Audio Video Embedder
Post Unapproval
Logout Prompt
Unanswered Topics
SMFPacks Shoutbox
Member Awards
Send Locked Topics To Bottom
Member NotePad
and more
There is small possibility that there was SMF Post Prefix but it wasn't used, maybe only installed and tried, but not approved to be in use for who knows what reason.
You're still assuming that it's a core bug - but I've literally never seen it in any version, and I'm someone that's even gone to the point of rewriting the behaviour, and still never saw the behaviour you're describing.
I could see several of your mods potentially screwing with pagination, not least send locked topics to bottom, post unapproval, global topics, separate the sticky topics.
Send locked topics to bottom was there before I even know for that forum, so we can exclude that mod, 99% not related with mod, then around time 2016-2018 we added Global topics and later Post unapproval and Separate the sticky topics. Last 2 were probably added months after problem occurred if not more than a year later. But still topic author have short list and all mods I mentioned in my last post are not on the list he provided.
Also I remember in past coder on that forum installed mod/s with errors, what he was doing back then and how, who knows. It can be related with error while installing or uninstalling mod/s.
@StarredSkies can you take a screenshot for home page/forum page with boards where we can see only Recycle bin board but don't click on board, need to see number of existing topics and posts in it. Also does that number changes when you do some action around, deletion of public topic/post or physical deletion from Recycle bin.
If Recycle bin is child-board, make it be as standalone board, place board on top or at bottom of forum and follow what changes and how. Follow what topics are displayed and are they randomly getting hidden once you do deletion action in public boards or in recycle bin. Take screenshots and compare for 1st and 2nd page. For me the most important thing to follow should be what happens to number of deleted topics/post in recycle bin, I believe it changes drastically.
Some old thoughts just came back to me about the reason why is this happening and why so far we are the only 2 known who experienced this.
1st possible reason could be because we count posts, so what will happen if you turn count posts off? Try that
2nd thing, I never tried this but you should create a new board and target it to be a new recycle bin, maybe your problem will solve from itself. Before you do it wait for info or ask how to change board for Recycle bin/deleted topics and posts. Not sure what happens if there are hundreds or thousands of posts and admin change board.
3rd - Enable recycling of deleted topics - wait for this info as well to not lose deleted posts/topics, but what happens if we turn this off and then again on?
4th - Count child's posts in parent's totals - disable for 1 day and check if something is changed, if nothing then enable it again.
For 2 and 3 I don't know what can happen so don't go before you are sure what you are doing.
The number of deleted topics/posts in recycle bin can also be the reason for this to happen since both forums in this case had long history, I guess your forum is up for years with nice amount of topics/posts.
I was observing that problem maybe longer than a year so with more info I can find similarities
Most definitely. Here's a screenshot of the board as you requested. The threads DO show up in the count. As for deletion, when deleting unapproved topics directly using Stop Spammer, the count DOES NOT change/add to the topic count. Meanwhile, deleting vanilla topics DOES add onto the count and DOES remove from the count when deleted from the Recyle board.
(https://i.imgur.com/4TogBxB.png)
As for your suggestions, I will try those now/wait for answers from support and get back to you! Apologies for the wait.
Also yes, we're an active forum and has been up for years, so that does make sense. + I appreciate all your help, especially since you had the same problem. Perhaps you'll find closure on your old problem too! <3333