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Author Topic: Global SMF social network  (Read 44210 times)

Offline sangham.net

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Global SMF social network
« on: February 26, 2013, 03:24:51 AM »
Dear SMF friends,

I guess I it will open another big barrel. Maybe one with good content and community nourishing.

Coming from sharing with social buttons and the experiences with global social network, I find the objectives of SMF somehow different to global tendencies of eating and being eaten as well as authority. A very healthy concept with immense potential.

Now, the social network of SMF users is somehow "limited" to the SMF community forum (mostly for forum runners) and for users the social network within SMF is mostly just inside the registered board.

What if such as a "Global SMF social network" would exist, a kind of sub forum every forum could add as well as a "Global SMF social network"-Membership which could be enabled as a special group within every board.

Its is imaginable that such as friendships between forums of similar interests could be forced even the integration of simply users of forums in the global network and feed back could be won.

I could also image a kind of "share" button within the "Global SMF social network", which would addopt a topic of post from another forum to your own (according to your permissions or within the "Global SMF social network"-section or sub forum in your forum). User could be enabled to wander through a bigger field of interactions even they have their home boards.

Today the Global discussions within the SMF community are merely limited to the topic SMF-softerware and Administrative issues but such a base could be used even for more.

Maybe a visionary thought for a big step forward of SMF use and accessibility which might be worthy to think more about.
From my experiences, forum users are often on many forums active as well as they also use social networks. Why not making SMF to a central point of global exchange? A big SMF society already exists (not sure if there are global data about it)

Hopefully I have not opened to many barrels at the same time. We could grow very distracted if we face to many pleasant seeming stuff at the same time and would be overwhelmed maybe. The "greed"-shock so to say, similar like a "fall of the Wall" - enticement with all its pro and contras.

So it should have its careful discussion generally, I guess.




Offline Colin

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #1 on: February 26, 2013, 03:39:08 AM »
Interesting idea, but it would have to be an opt in service.
"If everybody is thinking alike, then somebody is not thinking." - Gen. George S. Patton Jr.

Colin

Offline sangham.net

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #2 on: February 26, 2013, 05:23:19 AM »
Of course Colin,

other wise it would go astray from the original SMF objectives sooner pr later as well it would go into the danger of dictatorial or authoritative desire like of many other social networks with there natural conflicts an battles with each other.

So:
 "welcoming" not "forcing"
"optional expand able" not " head into a direction"
"an unbinding offering" not "a binding deal "

I guess SMF has its some great bridging objectives, why not put them into function also within all thousands of individual SMF forum boards. I guess that is very important otherwise very bridging will be soon just an outlet and there will be no or less flow back.


Offline Kindred

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #3 on: February 26, 2013, 07:46:22 AM »
it has been suggested before.

The answer is - NO.

A forum is a contained community. There is no need or desire to share users ebtween forums (and thus dilute the community of my own forum)
Additionally, 99.9% of the forums out there has no relationship with my forum - in tems of focus, topics or anything except software - and THAT is not a valid reason to link...

The SMF social community is HERE, in the forum which discusses SMF itself (and in forums like "the Admin Zone" which discusses forum ownership and administration across products)
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Offline Arantor

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #4 on: February 26, 2013, 08:58:15 AM »
Kindred, he's channelling Gri again!
To assume is to hope that those who came before had the presence of mind and capacity to implement the dreams of those who would come after.

You either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain. It seems you have chosen which, and now I must do the same.

Offline Kindred

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #5 on: February 26, 2013, 09:14:51 AM »
he is...  I don't think I have ever seen a German who is quite so indirect and obfuscatory.
lol...

except instead of "grivitations" he has some sort of buddhist-zen flow of consciousness thing going.

Of course, that doesn't make it any more comprehensible...
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Offline sangham.net

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #6 on: February 26, 2013, 10:23:13 AM »
Aside of your Gri-traumata... (must have been a deep cut) some "Maybe in addition" to express that issue a little more:

The final user would have the possibilities to join not only an individual forum but also the possibility to join the global SMF hood with all its members who enable this possibility.
It is for sure possible to have special membership rules and conducts for such a membership and it could be provided with every account creation in an individual forum.

With this possibility the envy and problems with changing the forum while leaving the last board would not exist and a Global member would have the possibility to request a forum specific membership as well.

It would be also able to make such as a global SMF portal where people can join to SMF in the first place and have the possibilities to travel through the individual forums and rest and dwell according to their preferences. That would be the payback of such board membership to SMF Global social network. So all in all an additional door which is away for the individual reach possibilities of individual boards.

So to say “Join the SMF Global social network and access more then 5000 different boards all around the world”. So the quality of the SMF objectives would be direct accessible by simply user.

I guess normally, user do not care much about the software it self and also not much about the hidden businesses behind which thy indirectly support.

SMF is a non-commercial platform and run mostly by voluntary SMF members by them self.

That brings back an useful pressure on ethical conducts among the individual forums as well and could give rise to a general different tendency toward healthy independecy but not on the costs of others.

It would also not need big servers like most social networks maintain, but the whole system is provided by many individual servers. SMF mother ship would just provide the interlinking with a huge travel guide and maybe a  - if handle able -  general meeting board.

The “likes” (posts linked back to the home) would go back to the home board where a member dwells as an individual normal forum member (that could be a programming challenge, of course if there is no general server but should be possible if the member carries information of his home board with him/her).

This would be also an inspiration to create once own board, to have a individual home. Maybe a light version of SMF board for individuals would be interesting in this case which could have also some hosting supports by third as well or a possibility on the SMF server.

SMF community would also have more access to the potential of the single forum user in regard of translations or other support as they do not have much knowledge of SMF it self now generally.

If you can image the potential behind this idea you only need to be careful of being not caught by greedy material attraction if for example a potential investor knocks on the door and likes to buy the SMF community for simply commercial use, but even that is not so dangerous like on usual social systems as it is still runs by many individual boards and home member ship will be mostly within the individual board from where who could work easy against such a dangerous tendency by leaving the global community ship.
So the “power” needs to be well balanced to enable such possibilities and give attractiveness for the existing board owners as well.



Offline Kindred

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #7 on: February 26, 2013, 10:44:00 AM »
we alreayd had a "global login" capability with "OpenID".
as a demonstratgion of how much this is NOT wanted, OpenID failed miserably...

basically...   as I said to start. No.

And, the load on the simplemachines.org servers to try and maintain such a list...   double no.
and SMF does not and will not ever offer hosting.

Users on my forum "Ask A Witch Community" have no desire to participate in my other forum "Legions of Steel Miniatures Wargaming" and vice versa. Actually, members of LOS, for the most part actively AVOID the "Warhammer 40K" wargaming forums. (and that is just three of my own forums...   spread that across 18 million different forums on 12 million different focus/topics)
There is very little cross over between forums.
And once again... If I have gone to the effort of getting a good and active group of users, why the hell would I want to share them and split their attention to any other forums?  If I did, the activity on MY forum would drop.


And there you go, harping on the translation stuff again...

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Offline sangham.net

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #8 on: February 26, 2013, 11:00:39 AM »
Kindred,

I do not want and SMF is not mine. I just share some ideas with the intention to be supportive and the impressions of future needs and problems. That is all. Whether you pic them up or not is yours, if you make it yours.

So really no problem for me and really no struggle to like it to have from my side.

If the SMF community is merely serving such stuff as wargaming forums I will be very careful to raise and further ideas. Of course such games and stuff can course may strange things in mind and one sees only enemies even if some one likes to support a little.

I guess I will make a step back again, as I see there is somehow a kind of general dislike in regard of the topics I opened and that has its reason. I don't think its good to go further in this direction as it would be just a matter of time till you would feel offend to an extension that would lead you to not only to unwholesome thought but also to unwholesome actions. So I will not give it further field to grow.

If you like to close the topic, feel free. There is no intention to put further on it from my side.

Be well and thanks for all your interest and patient before.


Offline Kindred

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #9 on: February 26, 2013, 11:34:46 AM »
the smf community serves MANY areas... actually, we probably have someone running a forum in any given focus...    My examples were just in 3 of the forums that I run myself and are definitely not represetnative of the general forums out there. :P


It's not your suggestions that we have issues with... It's how you present them.
There are two things wrong with your topics...
1- you present them in overly flowerly and difficult to understand language. I can not image that it makes any more sense in German than it does in English. German is an efficient language (and is the root of English, after all). When you want to present a suggestion, then present it. Don't go into all that other crap.

For example, your whole first post in this thread, could have been condensed into:
"I think it would be a great idea if SMF forums connected to each other. They could share users, allow users to take their account on one SFM forum and apply it to another and, in general make agloabl community of all SMF forums. Simplemachines.org would be the host of the integration list for any forums that chose to join."

the answer still would have been no... but it would not engender quite so much annoyance.

2- You seem to make assumptions about "what people want" and then be unwilling to listen to the people who know the systems, software and community better than you do.
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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #10 on: February 27, 2013, 10:06:39 AM »
Johann, I admire your enthusiasm, but I do find your latest proposal to be both unnecessary and impractical.

I agree with previous comments that this forum is the SMF community.  In my view, it doesn't make any sense to try to share users between fora via some kind of network.  To my mind, that's just trying to leech members from others sites, and that's not exactly well thought of behaviour.

It's well documented that this is the place to come to participate in the SMF community so to speak, and it's really the technical side, and the development of the forum software which does bring people together, so why start trying to broaden this?  I can only see it as an unnecessary burden, and I just don't see how it would benefit all the fora who signed up to it.  They already know where to come for support (here), and trying to bring together groups with divergent interests just sounds like a recipe for conflict to me.
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Offline emanuele

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #11 on: February 27, 2013, 11:38:24 AM »
A forum is a contained community. There is no need or desire to share users ebtween forums (and thus dilute the community of my own forum)
Additionally, 99.9% of the forums out there has no relationship with my forum - in tems of focus, topics or anything except software - and THAT is not a valid reason to link...
Well, that's you... :P

A (long) while ago I was thinking to such feature in order to share members between three similar-but-different communities (all speaking mainly about the same subject, but from different points of view and with different owners with very different ideas).
And I would be interested in it even now since I participate in two friendly communities (again similar-but-different) that already shares more than 60% of the users.


Take a peek at what I'm doing! ;D



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Offline Kindred

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #12 on: February 27, 2013, 11:51:33 AM »
emanuele,

OH, I can see your point of linking some related communities - but what Johann was suggesting was linking ALL SMF communities with a list through simplemachines.org.

I definitely would not mind a feature or mod which alloed you to share communities (posts? users?) across domains on an indvidual level.
I just can't see a "global smf web-ring" as being effective or useful.
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Offline Arantor

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #13 on: February 27, 2013, 12:03:02 PM »
*cough* IP.Connect *cough*
To assume is to hope that those who came before had the presence of mind and capacity to implement the dreams of those who would come after.

You either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain. It seems you have chosen which, and now I must do the same.

Offline Kindred

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #14 on: February 27, 2013, 12:19:38 PM »
???
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Offline Ricky.

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #15 on: February 27, 2013, 12:22:51 PM »
Ahem! Ahem.. !


Offline Arantor

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #16 on: February 27, 2013, 12:32:49 PM »
???

IP.Connect is a feature added in IPB 3.4 that allows you to bridge multiple IPB forums together, such that you can defer authentication from one forum to another and if an account doesn't occur on the slave, it will be created using the details from the master.

It is indeed very elegant and neatly sidesteps most of the bridging issues that normally occur.
To assume is to hope that those who came before had the presence of mind and capacity to implement the dreams of those who would come after.

You either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain. It seems you have chosen which, and now I must do the same.

Offline Ricky.

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #17 on: February 27, 2013, 12:45:11 PM »
I wished it for SMF long ago ..

But now that is not required as forum to be bridged are now on various platform including vb and IPB too .. ;)

Offline Kindred

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #18 on: February 27, 2013, 01:28:02 PM »
ah. yes, Arantor.   Like you describe for IP.Connect. :)   That would indeed be a good feature/mod.

As I said earlier, though - that is useful but is very different from the global SMFconnect that was originally asked about. :)
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Offline Arantor

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #19 on: February 27, 2013, 01:40:26 PM »
Conceptually it's a subset of what the OP is requesting - except it has the virtues of 1) making sense and 2) having a real practical use.
To assume is to hope that those who came before had the presence of mind and capacity to implement the dreams of those who would come after.

You either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain. It seems you have chosen which, and now I must do the same.

Offline sangham.net

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #20 on: February 28, 2013, 03:54:07 AM »


It's just a leave it open, make it possible, join-adventure, create real SMF community and more idea which of course would give SMF a huge different dimension.

Of course it would not have the purpose to make a bigger platforms for war-games or drug-misuse communities, that is why it is useful to have the SMF-agreements with some virtuous membership-rules for boards and members on the Global-Membership-level in between.

A software get's fast an image by a specific user kind as well...

The join adventure between two or three forums is a good start, but when making that feature, I guess its no problem to bring it to a higher level as well.

Some option ideas:

Global SMF settings:
* Join Global SMF community with your board? Yes/No  (Your board will be listed in the global directory of SMF - Global member and enables the possibility for SMF-Globalmembers to visit your board and vici versa)
* Select accepted languages: select list
* Select theme of your board where it should be listed: select list
* Set permissions for Global user group: couple of permission similar to other settings

Global SMF join adventure:
Invite friendship board list back to Global SMF member board directory/or link?
Accept requested: list of request...
...
Permissions...
 


Offline Kindred

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #21 on: February 28, 2013, 06:48:38 AM »
See johann, now this is your problem.
We have dismissed your initial idea as unworkable, but moved on to a variation which is not oly workable, but is actually a good idea...   And yet, now you go back to harping on the initial idea.
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Offline sangham.net

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #22 on: February 28, 2013, 08:41:08 AM »
Dear Kindred,

no problem, really.

Of course some things are interdependent and it might need a little to understand the whole thing. As it should be how ever a firm things, its good to thinks on 3.0 when doing the 2.0.5.

These are just ideas, nothing else. If you like them, good. If not, good as well. But don't make them depend on a uncleared cache. It make the whole system slow and the momentary computing capacity.

I guess I am the last who needs you to tell about such things. How to get the whole stuff run well and this is not by simply add another mod. The trauma has to be pulled out.

So if there is still a language trauma, just think in "english Global social network" dimensions. The other should be no problem later on, if desired. Or?

If we set ideas in relation with persons, its sometimes difficult. Then we might have a assuming of the person and miss to look at the action or idea. We do not see just idea but his, her, mine, our... idea. That might makr it difficult even to take the best things, as we regard it maybe as not mine. And what is not mine is not fine...

So simply letting go of the history of other topics, back to the topic here. If you like to change the topic starter, it is no problem. No desire to own or mark an idea with my avatar.


Offline Kindred

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #23 on: February 28, 2013, 08:52:52 AM »
holy mackeral, man - can't you ever write any response in less than a rennaissance novel?
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Offline sǝๅqɯɐɥS

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #24 on: February 28, 2013, 09:54:10 AM »
The more I see here, and in the other threads, the more I'm convinced these posts are being made by the prototype contextual "John Bot" I've been reading about. No, seriously.

Offline sangham.net

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #25 on: February 28, 2013, 10:55:41 AM »
You didn't mean him? Or did you, Shambles?

Maybe back to the topic, if a topic aside of John Bot is seen. Otherwise it would be more for the chatter box, I guess.
I am not sure if Kirmet would had run the show long if there had been just "seat in a box-guests" and no actor who really participate.

Of course for a good balance all is needed.


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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #26 on: February 28, 2013, 12:16:55 PM »
So if there is still a language trauma, just think in "english Global social network" dimensions. The other should be no problem later on, if desired. Or?

The only language trauma is trying to interpret what you mean when you reply.  My suggestion, if you want to be taken seriously by the people who work on SMF, would be to address the questions they ask you directly using as succinct a form a language as you can.  You might find people are more receptive to what you have to say if you adopt this approach.
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Offline sangham.net

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #27 on: March 01, 2013, 04:56:56 AM »
Dear Irisado,

Sometimes serious is good to release form seriousness, sometimes serious could increase seriousness. So its more a matter of taking it easy and serious and lesser a matter of taking it serious but not easy. But when we stuck, we stuck. We would let go, if we would let go, what would be left?

Thanks for your care, I will try to be more serious but no idea how to increase it even more.
Maybe it's good if you make the topic not depend on an assuming if the starter might be serious or not. Just the topic, nothing else.


Online Irisado

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #28 on: March 01, 2013, 05:59:28 AM »
Sometimes serious is good to release form seriousness, sometimes serious could increase seriousness. So its more a matter of taking it easy and serious and lesser a matter of taking it serious but not easy. But when we stuck, we stuck. We would let go, if we would let go, what would be left?

This is a prime example of what I'm talking about.  What you have said here doesn't make sense.

Quote
Thanks for your care, I will try to be more serious but no idea how to increase it even more.
Maybe it's good if you make the topic not depend on an assuming if the starter might be serious or not. Just the topic, nothing else.

If you don't really want to see the change that you're asking for (i.e. it's not a serious or genuine proposal), why ask for it to be implemented in the first place  ????
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Offline sangham.net

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #29 on: March 01, 2013, 09:05:44 PM »
Irisado, you would not take it serious either. Or you would take it to serious. So better ticking it off as flippancy and go on.


Offline Arantor

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #30 on: March 01, 2013, 09:32:54 PM »
And still no-one understands you, even when you make it a one liner.
To assume is to hope that those who came before had the presence of mind and capacity to implement the dreams of those who would come after.

You either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain. It seems you have chosen which, and now I must do the same.

Online Irisado

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #31 on: March 02, 2013, 05:52:11 AM »
Irisado, you would not take it serious either. Or you would take it to serious. So better ticking it off as flippancy and go on.

I interpret this as your not being interested in having a productive discussion about this, so if that's the case, I'm more than happy to stop.
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Offline sangham.net

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #32 on: March 02, 2013, 09:25:18 AM »
So we have cleaned the cache and can/could start again: Global SMF social network Of course only if you see any useful features hidden in all this ideas.

The objectives are different:

* Personal
* SMF Community
* SMF Product
* SMF Enduser
* SMF Boardrunner
* SMF general reputation
* SMF Markteing
* SMF Virtue/Conducts







Offline Orangine

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #33 on: March 02, 2013, 09:39:06 AM »
What cache have you cleaned? What are these 'objectives' that are not actually objectives at all?

Offline Arantor

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #34 on: March 02, 2013, 09:46:59 AM »
Quote
What cache have you cleaned?

In our understanding, I think. What he's saying is that we should ignore the previous and think freshly upon it.

Quote
What are these 'objectives' that are not actually objectives at all?

I'm still not convinced they're not just meaningless rambles.
To assume is to hope that those who came before had the presence of mind and capacity to implement the dreams of those who would come after.

You either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain. It seems you have chosen which, and now I must do the same.

Offline sangham.net

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #35 on: March 02, 2013, 07:50:31 PM »
Dear friends,

Quote
What cache have you cleaned?
In our understanding, I think. What he's saying is that we should ignore the previous and think freshly upon it.
Yes exactly. That is how things can be worked out to an end. Thanks for translation Arantor.

Quote
Quote
What are these 'objectives' that are not actually objectives at all?
I'm still not convinced they're not just meaningless rambles.
Cache still not cleaned. Maybe you give it a change. You would not delete any system data.

Let me know if there is a will of just go into the topic.


Offline Arantor

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #36 on: March 02, 2013, 07:55:04 PM »
Quote
Yes exactly. That is how things can be worked out to an end. Thanks for translation Arantor.

So why couldn't you just have said that?

Quote
Cache still not cleaned. Maybe you give it a change. You would not delete any system data.

Why do you have to make it so complicated? My cache is 'still not cleaned' because every time you come out with this random nonsense that I have to spend time making sense of.

In short: it's not cleaned because you still keep filling it up with hard to process concepts.
To assume is to hope that those who came before had the presence of mind and capacity to implement the dreams of those who would come after.

You either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain. It seems you have chosen which, and now I must do the same.

Offline sangham.net

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #37 on: March 03, 2013, 05:21:43 AM »
So what would a programmer do in such case?


Offline Orangine

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #38 on: March 03, 2013, 05:28:08 AM »
A programmer would hit you with $2000 bill for wasting their time with your nonsense.

Offline sangham.net

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #39 on: March 03, 2013, 10:44:31 AM »
Ohh! Of course that is also a way to save face and for sure not unusual. But what could be done in a voluntary - environment? Do you think that just saying "you are wasting their time with your nonsense" would be enough and sustainable to make a topic unreasonable and to get the neck out of the trap?

You are very welcome to participate on topic as well Orangine. Maybe you like to state your opinions in regard of it.
Thanks for your patient.




Offline Arantor

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #40 on: March 03, 2013, 10:47:55 AM »
Quote
Do you think that just saying "you are wasting their time with your nonsense" would be enough and sustainable to make a topic unreasonable and to get the neck out of the trap?

I don't know, let's try it.

*clears throat* Johann B, you are wasting our time with your nonsense.

Please, either say what you actually mean, in simple language, or leave us alone.
To assume is to hope that those who came before had the presence of mind and capacity to implement the dreams of those who would come after.

You either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain. It seems you have chosen which, and now I must do the same.

Offline ARG01

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #41 on: March 03, 2013, 11:09:23 AM »

*clears throat* Johann B, you are wasting our time with your nonsense.

Please, either say what you actually mean, in simple language, or leave us alone.

From what I have read, I am not sure that either is possible?  ???
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Offline sangham.net

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #42 on: March 03, 2013, 12:10:57 PM »
Just read, ARG:
Why argue? Just state your point and move on. If we all held the same opinions, everyone would be an idiot.

Arantor, yes let's try it. Tell me if it has not worked.





Offline Arantor

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #43 on: March 03, 2013, 12:12:01 PM »
It apparently is working thus far, you're posting one line comments that actually make sense. Please keep it up.
To assume is to hope that those who came before had the presence of mind and capacity to implement the dreams of those who would come after.

You either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain. It seems you have chosen which, and now I must do the same.

Offline ARG01

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #44 on: March 03, 2013, 12:34:34 PM »
Just read, ARG:
Why argue? Just state your point and move on. If we all held the same opinions, everyone would be an idiot.


I believe that's exactly what I did.  ;)
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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #45 on: March 03, 2013, 12:48:57 PM »
Had no idea it got so feisty on this polite techie forum. ???

I'm sure I'll be corrected, this idea sounds similar to this one....

Is there any app or way to collect new topics form multiple forums and display it in one place so you don't need to visit each of them separately?

That question is not only about SMF forums but including those too.

This idea of linking in this way sounds a bad idea on compatibility issues but also identity issues. And, anyone for some spam?

Okay so maybe I'm not the most constructive person around here for this topic, but I call a problematic idea when I see one. You're welcome. O:)

I feel I'd be shamelessly rehashing my old post if I elaborated so I'll opt for a short post. And press Post before I change my mind.

Offline enypsrozar

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #46 on: March 03, 2013, 01:03:10 PM »
So if there is still a language trauma, just think in "english Global social network" dimensions. The other should be no problem later on, if desired. Or?

The only language trauma is trying to interpret what you mean when you reply.  My suggestion, if you want to be taken seriously by the people who work on SMF, would be to address the questions they ask you directly using as succinct a form a language as you can.  You might find people are more receptive to what you have to say if you adopt this approach.

I didn't want to say anything as I thought I was the only one with this language barrier. Remember, you can answer point-by-point by stripping quotes to a few words that you can directly answer. I'm not an idiot, I understand English but it's hard to focus here.

Sometimes serious is good to release form seriousness, sometimes serious could increase seriousness. So its more a matter of taking it easy and serious and lesser a matter of taking it serious but not easy. But when we stuck, we stuck. We would let go, if we would let go, what would be left?

Thanks for your care, I will try to be more serious but no idea how to increase it even more.
Maybe it's good if you make the topic not depend on an assuming if the starter might be serious or not. Just the topic, nothing else.

Because of this and the above, I will let this thread go.

Offline sangham.net

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #47 on: March 03, 2013, 09:47:26 PM »
Just read, ARG:
Why argue? Just state your point and move on. If we all held the same opinions, everyone would be an idiot.

I believe that's exactly what I did.  ;)
Oh yes, I see that's the problem with believe, we just believe.



Had no idea it got so feisty on this polite techie forum. ???
I feel sorry, Enypsrozar,  if your impression is like we would act feisty with each other, but like always it's a matter of the observer. For sure it is correct that we tease each other a little, but that is just to get the cache empty.
So please do not see and ill-will behind each post.

I'm sure I'll be corrected, this idea sounds similar to this one....

Is there any app or way to collect new topics form multiple forums and display it in one place so you don't need to visit each of them separately?

That question is not only about SMF forums but including those too.
Somehow yes. A little similar as it is made on Facebook for example and I guess we do not need to talk about the success.

This idea of linking in this way sounds a bad idea on compatibility issues but also identity issues. And, anyone for some spam?
Of course it is something that needs to be well developed, and needs a Simply Machine behind. Like the development of SMF in rearguard of permissions is developed already, it does not seem to be a problem. You can allow a guest or member group to post or not, if there is a Global-SMF-membergoup it should be no problem at all. If you would set your permissions for  "Global-SMF-membergoup" equal with those of a guest, there is no different at all. The second level of this idea would be a "Join adventure - forums - memeber group", so for example the membership of "XYZ-Forum" which was added by inter-bridging to another forum.

Okay so maybe I'm not the most constructive person around here for this topic, but I call a problematic idea when I see one. You're welcome. O:)
I would not say so. Every expressed doubt is better as not expressing it. Of course it make only sense (for the individual person) if one is interested in getting involved. Nevertheless, even not really interested and more on the level "Just state your point and move on." can help those who are open to ideas even it was meant with some aversion or greed.
If you intention was good, even critical expressions will be supportive for your self. Nobody is able to pump good intentions into somebody else. One needs to see the useful stuff by one self, no other way at all.

I feel I'd be shamelessly rehashing my old post if I elaborated so I'll opt for a short post. And press Post before I change my mind.
Remorse is the protector of the world, so it's always good to listen to it. But there is also wrong and right shame. One should not have shame to do or say right and good things, even if the group pressure inducts different fear because it is not usual at all. But this fear (shame) is merely a egoistic and lesser what is meant by moral shame.
Sure, sometimes group shame and conducts do not compare with ones personal development of moral shame. If one just to follow the group pressure or keeps his heart open even it goes against the stream is a always a matter of courage. But I guess run to much off topic even this is of course a subtle issue in regard of Global-SMF as well. A good group pressure as well as a let it run and follow the mainstream, both has impact of each other. A non-group is a group as well.

Because of this and the above, I will let this thread go.
I know this promises well. One step inside and you are caught. If a simply declaration would be that easy that whole life would be easy. Letting go is not so easy as it seem. Displace might work for a good while but as you had seen, even a 3 month old post came back to your mind. So it was simply displaced and still not having let go of it. (that is called trauma, small or large is not the question, but the process is the same)
Now or later. You are in, whether you want or not. And there is nothing bad with it, actually the opposite if made wise.



Offline Arantor

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #48 on: March 03, 2013, 10:01:40 PM »
*buries head in hands, muttering a prayer to his false deities*

Quote
that's the problem with believe, we just believe.

I have no idea what you believe. You seem to believe that obfuscating what might have been a useful discussion with clouds of nonsense is helpful.

I believe you need to smoke something quite possibly illegal that will mess with your mind for you to understand what is so wrong here - it's like you're just not on the same level of thinking as normal people.

Quote
if your impression is like we would act feisty with each other, but like always it's a matter of the observer.

Any other observer in this discussion would conclude that you're talking utter nonsense and the rest of us are getting increasingly pissed off with wasting time trying to get through to you.

Quote
For sure it is correct that we tease each other a little, but that is just to get the cache empty.

<insert string of profanities> NO FOR ****** SAKE NO.

There's no teasing going on. There is you talking ****** and there is us wasting time trying to understand you. The only teasing is the amount of time you're wasting in our lives. I know one moderator today has threatened to close this thread but hopes in vain that you'll start to make sense. CLEAN *YOUR* CACHE. We're not the ones who have a communication problem.

Quote
If you would set your permissions for  "Global-SMF-membergoup" equal with those of a guest, there is no different at all. The second level of this idea would be a "Join adventure - forums - memeber group", so for example the membership of "XYZ-Forum" which was added by inter-bridging to another forum.

If only you had any inkling of what was wrong with your logic, but suffice to say, it doesn't work like that and no I'm not going to explain my logic to you until you start talking simple English.

Quote
Nevertheless, even not really interested and more on the level "Just state your point and move on." can help those who are open to ideas even it was meant with some aversion or greed.

I'm open to ideas. I'm not open to ideas dressed up in six tons of crap that I have to wade through to get to the idea. The only aversion is to YOUR ATTITUDE.

Quote
Letting go is not so easy as it seem.

That's certainly evident in dealing with your moronic posting. I am running out of words to describe it.
To assume is to hope that those who came before had the presence of mind and capacity to implement the dreams of those who would come after.

You either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain. It seems you have chosen which, and now I must do the same.

Offline ARG01

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #49 on: March 04, 2013, 12:09:30 AM »
Hey Johann B, it's funny that you attempt to put yourself off as some sort of intelligent being but your spelling and grammar bypasses your disguise as it is second only to a fourth grader. Make sure to register at my new site when it opens so I toss your IP into the Ban wagon.

Thanks.  ;)
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Offline sangham.net

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #50 on: March 04, 2013, 03:11:00 AM »
Dear Shenita574, ARG, Arantor, other participators,

I am used to it, but I appreciate your honesty. Maybe you give me about 3 or 4h and I will try to explain its function and benefit in another way. Simply on topic.


Offline sǝๅqɯɐɥS

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #51 on: March 04, 2013, 04:15:20 AM »
Quote
Maybe you give me about 3 or 4h and I will try to explain its function and benefit in another way...

Please don't.

Offline sangham.net

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #52 on: March 04, 2013, 07:30:41 AM »
killjoy

I made it a little shorter as estimated....

Note: This is a SMF Feeback - Forum. It might be that some points here will be not interesting for you or for you and maybe even not pleasant. Actually it's directed to the management, who ever feels in charge of it and it would be natural that not everybody understands what is meant or values it.

Its a wish for feedback forum and such is very important even it might itchy sometimes, it is at least also a pool of giving back. It could be, that you as a reader are not able to receive or get something out of it and even others who actually like to have critical feedback and hints will not have an easy to take out the essential.

Here we go for a last time (estimated)


The whole concept is based on simply estimations and all numbers are fictive as well as it is just a simply presentation. Over all I don't think that even a one million dollar project studies would lead to general different results. But that is assumed as well. Maybe good maybe not so good.


Current Situation (estimated)

SMF User (fictive licences & factor per lisence)

100.000 lisences / 500 user per lisence

Enduser 50.000.000 -> ........active participating in Community & Development 0,04% =    20.000
Developer 2.000 - > ............active participating in Community & Development 50% =    1.000
Forum Admin 200.000- > ..active participating in Community & Development 50% =    100.000
Forum Owner  50.000 - > .....active participating in Community & Development 50% =    25.000
Others, secondary user, interested persons   ................................................................4.000
“Active Members” in the community   .........................................................................150.000

(Note: if Forum Owner = Forum Admin it is counted under Forum Admin)

SMF- Quality:
Dependency and Interaction


Interactive participation   Active User   value in Persons   value in %

60 % Developers............1.000........600   2%
25 % Forum Admin......100.000....25.000   87%
10 % Forum Owner........25.000......2.500   9%
>5 % Enduser...............20.000.........500   2%
Sum.............................28.600................100%

The main group of interaction are Forum Admins and the whole system of development depends on the Forum Admins. There will to interact, their integrity, their virtue…

Technical Input quality in regard of the kind of participator

Qualification   value (interaction)   value   Input value
Developers 100%.......2   200   21%
Forum Admin 50%......87   435   46%
Forum Owner 30%.....9   210   22%
Enduser 50%.............2   100   11%
Sum..................................945   100%

Also here it is visible that the whole system stands and falls with the Admins, their quality and will to participate.

Developers are merely a minority but are the most integrated and with it most powerful part on the system. Of course there is also strong dependency between Forum Owner and Forum Admins and the developer if they are financial dependent on them.

The participation and flow back from the end uses is very low. How ever this group has a long time impact on SMF but the impact is actually very temporally delayed and hard to estimate form the SMF team as there is also no real feed back and measure system.

Current flows of Information, Feedback and release availableness.



 
This graphic may show the current situation of participating and flow in regard of the different kinds of SMF community members.

Abstract of the current situation:

The present SMF – Society can be compared with a liberal feudal system. While the King (SMF team) gives rights (free) to the Forum Owner, the Admins are like the ministers of small realms. The community of developers could be compared with mercenaries who merely work in regard of the wishes from the sponsors or in regard of their joy with the work it self.
The end user plays only a minor rule in the whole system but is the at least the supplier. The bonding of the supplier (end user) is primarily torward the Forumadmin (& / or Owner). As long as the end user gets the food he expected and as long as the Forum admin is active involved to provide this food, the whole system works good.

If the Forum admin (&/or owner) is no more able to fit the wishes of the end user, he will lose them easy if other landowner offer alternative and more attractive playground.

One great danger in a feudal system is the fall into corruption of the dukes (Admin & Owner). If they fail to supply an balance of giving and taking indirectly between end user and the king but work simply for their benefit it limits the prosperity below them as well as under them at the same time while the king and the end user might be not aware oft the situation and the break down of the whole empire is a merely spontaneous.

The second danger of such an empire is the dependency of an honored king (SMF team). If this king dies or his policy is not able to guide the dukes (admins and owner) well, the Kingdom easily splits and finally disappears. The dukes will remain how ever.

Also the mercenaries are playing a very important rule and as long as they feel obligated at least to the king (whether he is the one who feeds or gives the value of honorable indirectly –see: Sub-fonding of mod - developers from the mothership).

The fourth danger is the danger of organizational blindness as the whole team in charge is mainly a technical team and especial technical specialist have a huge tendency to what is called “nerd” (somebody how might be a guru in his profession but has no ideas of what is going on beside of it and mostly less general knowledge). That is normal within an organization and if the management is able to use it well there is no danger, but if the whole management is of the same color, it leads easy to simply global maverick-hood within a community. A kind of community blindness.

All this dangers are not so big if there is a kind of direct interacting or a feeling of togetherness. The only reference for the user is the duke or his realm but there is mainly no identification with SMF. If the identification with the duke or his forum fails there is not a little bound to SMF it self.

So the end user is easy to move away from SMF at least and his bondage simply exists within the forum and its qualities among the dukes’ possibilities and effort.


The current advantages and disadvantages of SMF form a end user view:

As long as the admin and the owner are very active and also supply the demands of the developer SMF is a very good field to feed and play. The dangerous limit is if the owner and admin fail to bring constant new wind and participator as a static community never last long and need its alternations and fresh inputs.
The big advantage of SMF or forums general is that they enable a good administrate-able field of discussion. That is the big lack of the most social systems.

The disadvantages of SMF or forums generally are, that the spectrum of food is limited to a small realm and dependent on its function. Users are coming and going and I guess the normal time of duration of participating is not more as 5 Month on one forum. Then the ordinary user changes two or three times and after 3 years he/she will abound the participation on forums totally as it is of course also not easy to keep ones avatar long lasting within a particular community.

Comparison with Social networks:

Social networks have the opposite tendencies like SMF for example. They pull the flow out and forums are mainly suppliers but nearly never in the other direction.
While most social networks have focused on much individualism the end user need the participation in groups and discussions are loved. Most lack on a good system but there (as much as I know) are many efforts to make it to a different on facebook for example where are experiments of quoting to a particular post (maybe it already exists, it was a half a year ago as I heard about it).
Today leaders are blogs, as they also supply some interacting between individuals and cross postings, but they are little limited in regard of communities.
SMF and forums are mainly group adventures and have less value on the individual. That is of course the reason why there are more and more forums. As soon as one jumps of  a group he/she founds his own forum. So forums will grow more and more, but will also reach a level where the interaction will be missed and as there is no possibility within the global forum community they will search for alternatives.

Solution to prevent for future or maybe already existence tendencies:

SMF has actually a hidden costumer quantity which is not small and counts for sure millions of participators who are not actively involved or bound to SMF.

A GLOBAL SMF membership would satisfy the end user, the duke and the king as well and could create a huge side social system of a different kind and in an environment of giving and taking and not simply consuming.

It would allow and encourage even to more and smaller communities without the disadvantage of losing the connection to a bigger group, no exactly the opposite. While it would bring the possibilities of join adventures among existing boards, it opens the SMF end user to stay within the community of SMF.

If a commercial social network would develop such it would properly need some million dollars to bring it to the end user, within the SMF community it simply needs the participation and valuing of the current active community members.

The threefold bounding in a network of giving and taking:

It’s very important to understand that actually nothing in this world is free and it is good to transport it honest to the end user as well. It might be, even it is rare, that somebody likes to give something for free, but that does not mean that there will be a receiver who is able to take it.
Sometimes we see that system, sometimes not and there is a reason why people sometimes even get angry if they are given to much which they are not able to return.
Facebook is a sample. If you can not give something back – for example through identification and honor – you might even be angry and like to blame the giver for having bad intentions while giving. Actually one has taken to much but sees no possibility to pay it back as it might be that it is not possible to honor and value this or that way of acting.

A good community exists when the giving and taking is balanced. A simply consuming society will live joyful for a while but face a bad future as the past merits will run out sooner or later.

Currently there is only one real bound and that is on the base of the software license and all around it depends on the effort and involvement of the participator. So there is just a contract between the king and the duke and even his further actions are mainly out of range of the king.

The threefold bounding of Global SMF would exist without touching or change the current policy in regard of SMF software but offer a free participation in a different social network.

GLOBAL SMF – Forum:
A participating of the forum on an network of GLOBAL –SMF a little similar like the news-feed or support system now but more in direction of better feedback.

GLOBAL SMF Forum – Join Adventure:
Within the participation on the big SMF community ones forum is listed and free to connect with others or the mother community.
With it there will be much more interacting between the boards as well as feedback stream to the mother community. General conducts of usage could be bound to the use of this tool. That goes in direction of the quality of forum owner and user as well especially in regard of virtue. For example if somebody is using the software to deal with drugs, sexual misconducts, hacker paradise or bootleg “fine”, but not possible within the GLOBAL SMF Forum membership. The closer interacting of the single forums will regulate some good amount of reputation for the SMF users.

GLOBAL SMF User Accessibility:
Within the individual regulations of the single boards SMF GLOBAL USER have the possibility to access other forums and cross post with relation to their home board. The home board could be the mother community of SMF as well.
A user would not need to leave the SMF sphere if he/she does not find food on particular boards but will find connection to others as well. Of course there is some amount of advantage in regard of permanent misuses as well. But the accessibility direct to the particular boards would also hinder the danger of global mobbing as well.


Closing rate:

I guess the further development is good left within the SMF-community and the SMF-Team it self and I guess it is a field of joy with great work and individual ideas. Of course it could be developed this a firm and executable requirement specification as well but that you take the join within community work and collective creativity.
At the end even somebody would come and threat with a 200.000 + 2.000 dollar bill and that would make nobody happy as only own work will bring real and lasting joy.

I hope I could finally transport some points and the need of “Sub fonding for developers” development of language issues and real “multilingualism” and the very need of waking up the huge potential of the end user and their capacity to make it to a long lasting and heal “global community”. All of them are simply small parts and steps within a simply machine and maybe there will be soon a social button around the websites of the internet realm.

Why make it complicate if you can have your own Simple machine?


« Last Edit: March 04, 2013, 07:53:05 AM by Johann B »

Offline Kindred

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #53 on: March 04, 2013, 07:51:04 AM »
well, a few things...

1- your model is just plain wrong. That's not how things are.
2- your concept, as we have already explained - while there could be interested between 2-3, maybe even 5 different forums to share - there is no point no interest (I would go so far as to say active DISinterest) in making sn SMF webring across "all smf" sites.
3- you just don't listen/read  ---   or maybe more to the point, you actively dismiss anyone who (and ignore any concept which) disagrees with your preconceived notion of how you think the world SHOULD work.
Please do not PM, IM or Email me with support questions.  You will get better and faster responses in the support boards.  Thank you.

Offline sangham.net

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #54 on: March 04, 2013, 07:57:55 AM »
Remember those things in latest two years.

Offline Orangine

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Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #55 on: March 04, 2013, 10:04:21 AM »

Offline petabyte

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  • whatever...
Re: Global SMF social network
« Reply #56 on: March 31, 2013, 04:45:50 PM »
what on earth was all that?  SMF meets a very drunk Shakespeare?