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Author Topic: November Update  (Read 63886 times)

Offline Gargoyle

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Re: November Update
« Reply #40 on: November 07, 2013, 07:56:03 PM »
But I got to say glad to see things are moving along, please don't get stuck on someone's like or dislike..

Agreed x2

Offline Arantor

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Re: November Update
« Reply #41 on: November 07, 2013, 08:09:07 PM »
I'm not stuck on anyone's like or dislike. I'll listen to the commentary, sure, and I'll try and take it on board but ultimately I'm building what I think SMF needs and going from there.
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Re: November Update
« Reply #42 on: November 08, 2013, 08:25:16 AM »
I know you will not get stuck on that, could have worded it differently ... I just wanted to say your doing great :) and moving on and kinda speaking in general to those that can not be pleased LOL!

regards,
Maxx

maxg

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Re: November Update
« Reply #43 on: November 10, 2013, 09:50:23 AM »
Spent a little time Yesterday with the 2.1 alpha 1 and did a fresh install. So far I'm very much liking what I see, the install painless and fast, I like the menu better fast roll down and the Admin section is looking good, should be easier for folks to find their way around :) Gonna start working once again on doing themes from scratch to see how that goes, have done so in the past and went well so hopefully the same. Note I did notice and I like!!! that you will get an error message if the theme is not compatible with the current version... this will keep you from a mess if the theme does not work with the System :) also notice better security, for moderators and admins... Cool!

I would recommend that you disable all mods and and custom themes before upgrade ( just me) and if you do a fresh install, I would not try to overwrite old tables, I would do a fresh Database:)

and as mentioned above don't forget the "other" ( folder) for install and upgrade file!

There are a few issues, in saving theme edits after current theme edits, I sent this to the DEV team!:)

regards,
Maxx


Offline SoLoGHoST

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Re: November Update
« Reply #44 on: November 10, 2013, 06:08:36 PM »
Ok, I am slacking a bit on the download of the new 2.1 here.  I'll hopefully get around to seeing it before it gets released... hehe.

Offline Arantor

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Re: November Update
« Reply #45 on: November 10, 2013, 06:12:36 PM »
@maxg: I did see your PMs, sorry I didn't reply before, just been very busy and not gotten through them all.

@SoLoGHoST: and already there's been new stuff since I wrote this post ;)
To assume is to hope that those who came before had the presence of mind and capacity to implement the dreams of those who would come after.

You either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain. It seems you have chosen which, and now I must do the same.

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Re: November Update
« Reply #46 on: November 10, 2013, 07:59:00 PM »
Arantor,

The link I sent you to the 2 files of concern, does fix the errors and It will now work if you save the current theme edit changes 2 times. ( hope that helps!)

And thanks for thee reply... appreciate all you guys are doing here.. Stay Good my friend!

regards,
Maxx

Offline SoLoGHoST

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Re: November Update
« Reply #47 on: November 10, 2013, 10:01:14 PM »
Just a thought, and I know SMF is a forum software, not a CMS.  But I always felt limited by topics, as if they just always look the same, always have the same content fields, with very little room for improvement, other than a mod to install that can advance it a bit.  But there was never any real simple solution built into SMF for manipulating how boards are shown, how topics get displayed, and how fields within posts are managed (unmanaged I mean to say).  Would be nice if the Admin had the ability to display topics as articles, or maybe as just a simple webpage.  I suppose this is getting into a CMS type of thinking, but maybe it's time for SMF to grow into something bigger, god knows it has tried.

And I'm sure with Arantor on the Dev. Team, we can expect great things for SMF!

Offline Arantor

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Re: November Update
« Reply #48 on: November 10, 2013, 10:07:44 PM »
That is not going to happen any time soon. There really is not a lot you can do with boards and topics without making them not boards and topics, SMF is geared towards being a *forum* not a generic CMS.

The thing is, you need articles to do things differently to topics, they have different characteristics, different approaches, different needs for metadata and so on - it's not just presentation but experience, and trying to create a one size fits all approach to that is actually doing them a disservice.

That isn't to say I don't have answers for this stuff, because I do. It just doesn't involve trying to make topics into something they're not.
To assume is to hope that those who came before had the presence of mind and capacity to implement the dreams of those who would come after.

You either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain. It seems you have chosen which, and now I must do the same.

Offline SoLoGHoST

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Re: November Update
« Reply #49 on: November 10, 2013, 11:36:02 PM »
Well, I think the nuts and bolts of how this would be is to create fields and than allow those fields to be manipulated via code, and/or even packaged up and installed in SMF.  Fields that would add to the already known fields of what topics are:  Title, Body, Attachment, Avatar, Signature, Extra Info., etc.  These fields could than be manipulated to show however the Admin wants them to be shown, or not shown.  This would than expand SMF into something even bigger, making it possible to attach, say fancybox Field, or Like Button Field (which I believe is now default in SMF 2.1 as I hear, or an option already atleast), or any field anyone can think of that would be suitable for topics.  So, like, I haven't seen SMF 2.1 yet, so maybe I'm speaking prematurely here.

In any case, I'm not the one in charge anyways.  I'm sure that SMF will be everything that everyone here has grown to love and more!

Offline Arantor

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Re: November Update
« Reply #50 on: November 10, 2013, 11:48:59 PM »
No. I will only say this for the ... third? ... time: I am not going down this road. Trying to make a one-size-fits-all solution is terrible, I mean did you ever look at the mess WP is under the hood? That's in no small part because you can define arbitrary fields per content and have them displayed.

Have the topics be *topics* and handle proper meta data for them. Articles need different things to forum topics, as do downloads, gallery items, and many other things.
To assume is to hope that those who came before had the presence of mind and capacity to implement the dreams of those who would come after.

You either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain. It seems you have chosen which, and now I must do the same.

Offline SoLoGHoST

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Re: November Update
« Reply #51 on: November 11, 2013, 12:23:15 AM »
Ok, so WP was never exactly supposed to be a CMS, it is a Blog, period!  This is why it's a ton of mess under the hood.  And probably why you are right in your thinking here as well.  SMF is a Forum, not a CMS, much like WP is not a CMS (though it somehow sneaked it's way into a CMS, which is why it's terrible).  Don't get me wrong, WP is a great Blogging Platform, but that's it!  Trying to make it into something it's not only causes huge headaches!

Offline SoLoGHoST

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Re: November Update
« Reply #52 on: November 11, 2013, 03:23:32 AM »
Hey Bloc, exactly my thoughts.  My thinking on this may be influenced, partly, from the Drupal CMS, which I have been dabbling in for quite some time now.  The idea is to break everything into pieces that can be built onto.  Trying to get as generic/general as possible requires taking many many steps backwards.  I kind of admire the way Drupal handles Nodes, Taxonomy, Structuring of Content, url aliases, and even blocks, that when coupled with the Views Module (which is basically 1 huge SQL Query that you create with a WYSIWYG UI via Views UI) just blows your mind of the possibilities, 95%+ CMS, 5%- coding.  I've seen full Drupal sites built with absolutely no coding whatsoever.  Here's a good example of a site I recently took part in building, for work, with Drupal:  http://ofn.org  This entire site was literally built in just a weekend.  However Content for the site was another story, that took several weeks to get all of the content for it together from the old site and it's still not finished with content.
« Last Edit: November 11, 2013, 03:37:13 AM by SoLoGHoST »

Offline margarett

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Re: November Update
« Reply #53 on: November 11, 2013, 04:06:40 AM »
I guess that's what was intended with smCore.

Anyway, despite the "easiness", a huge query is hardly most efficient than several smallest, well thought, queries. And SMF is usually more performant at this level...
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Offline SoLoGHoST

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Re: November Update
« Reply #54 on: November 11, 2013, 04:30:47 AM »
Yeah, I definitely agree that SMF handles the database way better than most platforms that I have ever used.  This is 1 drawback in Drupal since, for each Module that loads on a page, we are talking about .8 tenths of a second of load time.  There are caches you can put into place that will help with this as well as faster loading, but the database gets hit too much.  If I output db queries, I can see about 10 times more than SMF.  But SMF is not a CMS either.  So I don't think you can compare SMF to Drupal exactly.  Not trying to go into that cause that would be like comparing Apples to Oranges.  Drupal could definitely improve more ofcourse, especially with the database.

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Re: November Update
« Reply #55 on: November 11, 2013, 09:41:34 AM »
I in reality feel that, as mentioned many times in the past, I have tried most all forum and CMS systems, even some paid and still I insist that SMF is the Best of all and should remain on it's current path!

The other stuff Like Blog, galleries, article pages and shouts and gadgets (if you will!) are being well represented By Great Folks like Bloc and his Protendo and Wedge, Bloc In my opinion is doing a fantastic Job of bring forward, what can and can not or should not be done with the SMF system, yet keeping it very nice and fast and clean looking as well as user friendly. A forum is a forum period. and most all of them will look and feel basically the same!

The other stuff, a few Like Bloc are already working hard on and showing me great progress.
I started making themes for WP and Drupal and other CMS systems and Pete hit the nail the first time with WP and Bloc the second with Drupal, this system are a mess so to speak in trying to start working with ( JMHO), and unless we want to get off track and delay SMF any more - possible a few years LOL, I 'd stick to guns gentlemen and keep up the great job.

I'm liking it! :)
Maxx

Offline Akyhne

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Re: November Update
« Reply #56 on: November 11, 2013, 10:38:49 AM »
Just a thought, and I know SMF is a forum software, not a CMS.  But I always felt limited by topics, as if they just always look the same, always have the same content fields, with very little room for improvement, other than a mod to install that can advance it a bit.  But there was never any real simple solution built into SMF for manipulating how boards are shown, how topics get displayed, and how fields within posts are managed (unmanaged I mean to say).  Would be nice if the Admin had the ability to display topics as articles, or maybe as just a simple webpage.  I suppose this is getting into a CMS type of thinking, but maybe it's time for SMF to grow into something bigger, god knows it has tried.

And I'm sure with Arantor on the Dev. Team, we can expect great things for SMF!
You can partly achieve this by having another theme for a specific board.

Offline SwedishMarch1964

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Re: November Update
« Reply #57 on: November 11, 2013, 10:42:53 AM »
Thanks for the heads up!  :)
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Offline Akyhne

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Re: November Update
« Reply #58 on: November 11, 2013, 11:25:08 AM »
What about smartphone/pad/tablet detection with proper theme. Will this be implemented into SMF 2.1?

Offline Arantor

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Re: November Update
« Reply #59 on: November 11, 2013, 11:27:53 AM »
Sadly, I just don't see that happening. Bear in mind I only joined the dev team a few weeks ago and already there's been a massive amount of change but a complete mobile environment is only going to delay SMF 2.1 even more. As it is, I'm working on a major feature for SMF 2.1 that's already delayed it more than I wanted it to be delayed and this suggestion will put it back by probably another 6 months.
To assume is to hope that those who came before had the presence of mind and capacity to implement the dreams of those who would come after.

You either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain. It seems you have chosen which, and now I must do the same.