Alerts Help

[voom]

Thanks

Now it's: /opt/plesk/php/7.4/bin/php -q /path/to/smf-www-root/cron.php

I'll report tomorrow if it works now...

[voom]

I am not sure, I have not received any alerts at all since setting up the cron. There was activity in a thread I started that is in a forum with activated alerts.

The cron puts out the following, which looks fine to me:

Code Select Expand

array(8) {
  [0]=>
  array(3) {
    ["file"]=>
    string(62) "/path/to/web-root/cron.php"
    ["line"]=>
    int(287)
    ["function"]=>
    string(9) "log_error"
  }
  [1]=>
  array(3) {
    ["file"]=>
    string(84) "/path/to/web-root/Sources/AutoEmbedMediaPro2.php"
    ["line"]=>
    int(415)
    ["function"]=>
    string(22) "smf_error_handler_cron"
  }
  [2]=>
  array(3) {
    ["file"]=>
    string(84) "/path/to/web-root/Sources/AutoEmbedMediaPro2.php"
    ["line"]=>
    int(229)
    ["function"]=>
    string(22) "MediaProisMobileDevice"
  }
  [3]=>
  array(3) {
    ["file"]=>
    string(70) "/path/to/web-root/Sources/Subs.php"
    ["line"]=>
    int(3840)
    ["function"]=>
    string(15) "MediaProProcess"
  }
  [4]=>
  array(3) {
    ["file"]=>
    string(89) "/path/to/web-root/Sources/tasks/CreatePost-Notify.php"
    ["line"]=>
    int(569)
    ["function"]=>
    string(9) "parse_bbc"
  }
  [5]=>
  array(5) {
    ["file"]=>
    string(89) "/path/to/web-root/Sources/tasks/CreatePost-Notify.php"
    ["line"]=>
    int(270)
    ["function"]=>
    string(26) "handleWatchedNotifications"
    ["class"]=>
    string(28) "CreatePost_Notify_Background"
    ["type"]=>
    string(2) "->"
  }
  [6]=>
  array(5) {
    ["file"]=>
    string(62) "/path/to/web-root/cron.php"
    ["line"]=>
    int(237)
    ["function"]=>
    string(7) "execute"
    ["class"]=>
    string(28) "CreatePost_Notify_Background"
    ["type"]=>
    string(2) "->"
  }
  [7]=>
  array(3) {
    ["file"]=>
    string(62) "/path/to/web-root/cron.php"
    ["line"]=>
    int(131)
    ["function"]=>
    string(12) "perform_task"
  }
}
Error loop.


[Arantor]

No, that's the cron hitting a fatal error possibly caused by the media embed mod. More specifically, it's failing upon trying to put the error it encountered into the error log.

Cron.php encountering no errors reports no output.

[voom]

Yup, I uninstalled the media embed mod and instantly alerts arrive....

The log error - could it be a file permissions issue? Or is the log in the db? What can I do about that?

[FrizzleFried]

I really didn't want to revisit this crap again but my users just keep hounding me.

For example... this user would really like to know how in the hell he went from 15 alerts in one minute...

You cannot view this attachment.

(note the time)

To 105 alerts a minute later...

You cannot view this attachment.

I can't answer these questions with anything other than "The Alerts System is Fundamentally Broken"... because damnit,  I'm just done giving a damn about it.  I can turn that crap off,  right?  I think I might.  It's just... broke but I am sure there will be plenty here that will chime in telling me how wonderfully it works... which is maddening because it just doesn't.  I hate to say this but its 100% true...

Sorry guys.  I really don't like to crap on peoples code... but a duck is a duck and this one has been quacking since day one.

EDIT: Damnit... it's LIKES and MENTIONS that can be turned on/off.  >argh<

[Kindred]

I don't believe it is broken -- unless one of your many hacks done by people who are not our developers broke it...

[Arantor]

No, fairly sure the only hack to the alerts was the one I wrote, which just takes out some force-marking-written.

The real question is whether the 105 alerts are the real count and if that's just the delay of cron being run to chew through a batch of things.

Or even a rogue other job blocking the queue in the meantime.

[FrizzleFried]

I don't believe it is broken -- unless one of your many hacks done by people who are not our developers broke it...

My perspective:

A "working" alerts system should not go from 15 to 105 alerts in 45 seconds... when that user had been on the site for minutes prior.  That is a broken system.  Sorry.

Even if it does that because of "technical reasons"... that doesn't make it any less broken.  I know it can be done better... I used to run a mod that did it better... so whatever you want to call it,  even if it's "working as intended"... it's working "broke".

It also has happened HERE to me... BTW... so there goes the idea of it being my forum only... and that's not taking in to account the other users here who have complained as well.

EDIT: BTW ... as Arantor pointed out... the ONLY change to original code was his code.

[Arantor]

So, the first question, did the user really have 105 alerts? What was the timescale of them coming in?

Remember: you're not Facebook, you don't have a data centre. There *must* be a throttle of sorts for alerts being processed at scale; SMF has to cope with being both for tiny and massive sites. (If the paid alerts mod you had had been installed here, it would require another 1-2 servers to run it rather than the multiple servers it *already* has.)

So there is a queue in which tasks get carried out. The queue gets processed occasionally - pretty sure we advised you to set it up to check the queue once a minute with a cron task on the server.

I suspect that there are occasional clogs in the queue pipe which accounts for the spiky load that you have - but I still believe you were meant to get the 105 alerts until I hear anything otherwise.

I have to be honest, I haven't seen the issues you refer to myself on this site. That doesn't mean they don't happen, but I haven't seen them myself. The behaviours I see correlate to what I expect from how it was originally designed and later implemented.

[FrizzleFried]

Oh,  and I am still in the dark how I could get 7 likes here in a post ... but only 2 alerts (in total)?  Seems broken...no?

It seems that if you stay on top of the alerts (as I do typically) ... all works well.  If I let them collect,  it gets stupid.

I'll see what I can do to collect more info.  That said... I really would prefer just to yank the whole damn thing if possle.  I bet I could remove the button easily enough... but all the related BS (profile stuff... alert settings stuff) would be too much to bother with.

At this point just responding with "It's broken..." just might be the way to handle things as I suspect it's not going to be 'fixed' anytime soon.

Sorry... the behavior (obviously due to tech issues it seems) just sucks... by design it seems.

Remember: you're not Facebook, you don't have a data centre. There *must* be a throttle of sorts for alerts being processed at scale; SMF has to cope with being both for tiny and massive sites. (If the paid alerts mod you had had been installed here, it would require another 1-2 servers to run it rather than the multiple servers it *already* has.)

It did alerts right.  Maybe it's not possible to do alerts 'right' with a very large site... you know that more than I so I bow to your expertise.  But then how do sites like xenforo do things... right?  I've NEVER had 110 alerts just pop up on any Xenforo site... ever... not once. (I do have to admit I only frequent one but it's a major arcade site I visit daily).

EDIT: BTW... i am not trying to be argumentative.  I am simply stating a fact... the alerts are broken.  They do not work correctly (at least what an average user would expect would be "correct"... not the version of "correct" that is being espoused by some here).  Now,  if the official response to that is to try to blow sunshine up my skirt,  so be it... that's fine... but it does not change the fact.

EDIT #2: FWIW I am a little pissy today... my 12 year old son left his backpack at the San Diego International Airport... with nearly $1000 worth of crap in it (ipad, $350 heated gloves for my wife,  $150 headphones).... yeah... I'm not a happy camper today and reading my posts it seems to be shining through.  Maybe I need to walk away for a while.   )

EDIT #3: Anyone got a Snickers? (only the US crowd would know this!)



Actually, the UK 'crowd', as you put it, would also understand the references an dit was translated into other languages in Europe too.  Also, I've got a modify button and so have you.  Please use it instead of serial posting .  Posts merged - Iris.

[Arantor]

by design it seems.

Yes, I suck and will be leaving now. I was willing to invest in improving this but clearly the time and energy was a waste all round.

[FrizzleFried]

by design it seems.

Yes, I suck and will be leaving now. I was willing to invest in improving this but clearly the time and energy was a waste all round.

Arantor... I think you know me a little better than that... and you know I'm not intending to offend.  My apologies for doing so.  Please see my above edit.  Walking away now.

EDIT: Walking back to clarify... when I said "Sorry... the behavior (obviously due to tech issues it seems) just sucks... by design it seems." I was referring to the fact that it appears the code was designed with the potential of very large forums thereby restricting the options on the table... hence the "obviously due to tech issues" portion of my comment.

I could have worded many of my responses today better.  Mind you... my position has not changed ... i certainly could have been a little more diplomatic in my expression for sure.  To be 100% honest... it was Kindred's response which I had the foresight of predicting (It's just... broke but I am sure there will be plenty here that will chime in telling me how wonderfully it works... ) ... that riled me up a bit more than it should have.  I really need a beer... but being that I've not had a taste of alcohol in nearly 3 years,  that's likely not going to happen today.

Anyway,  again,  I apologize Arantor.

[Kindred]

I repeat... alerts are not broken in the core product. They might not work exactly like some people want them to work, but they work as intended.

What you are seeing is either limited to your site or limited by your misunderstanding.

Your continued declaration that things are broken is tiresome.

[Arantor]

but they work as intended

Sorry, no, they don't. I believe I am qualified to make that statement.

Also, wish I'd never fought for their inclusion or implemented the system. I now believe 2.1 would have been better if literally none of my changes had been implemented, but that's another story.

[FrizzleFried]

I repeat... alerts are not broken in the core product. They might not work exactly like some people want them to work, but they work as intended.

What you are seeing is either limited to your site or limited by your misunderstanding.

Your continued declaration that things are broken is tiresome.

I disagree that they work "right".  They may work as intended,  but as intended is not "right". 

Sorry.  This duck doesn't chirp. 

EDIT: Seriously... where is that snickers? 

Look... I guess "right" is in the eye of the beholder.  To me... there is never a time where an alert should just pop up randomly... let alone a dozen or a hundred... it just makes the entire system seem... untrustworthy.

If you get an alert,  you should get that alert... in a timely fashion.  Not next week.  Not next month.  Not in a group of 20 all at one time.

If that happens.. the system seems... broken.  To me.  To my users.  But not to Kindred.

Got it.

[Darkness7148]

I have to agree. There are some serious issues with the alerts. I still haven't got any on this forum for weeks even though when I go to the Alerts page, it's packed full of new alerts. The number just doesn't seem to reflect properly.

[Diego Andrés]

Here I get a few every morning even if I have more, but during the day I get none in the popup even if they are in the actual alerts page.

[voom]

For me, it also still has not picked up as expected. As discussed in this thread, there was a mod leading to the cron jobs not running correctly. That was repaired. The cron runs every minute. Even when I am active in the board, alerts mostly come in bulk, and too late. Meaning: after I have already read the respective post etc. So: new alerts are not picked up every minute, and changed states of posts are not (always) detected when alerts are created.

[Diego Andrés]

This actually has never happened to me before, so thought I'd share:

You cannot view this attachment.

[FrizzleFried]

This actually has never happened to me before, so thought I'd share:

You cannot view this attachment.

I've seen that.  That is normal.  You have to remember that alerts are not broken in the core product as indicated by the Support Lead for SMF.  Your issues are obviously with your servers (at your own sites) or maybe PEBCAK here at the official support site.