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Started by Paulsa, May 04, 2022, 04:23:22 PM

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Kindred

Quote from: Arantor on May 06, 2022, 08:15:16 AMIn any case how do you know very few would use it? Did you ask a statistically relevant sample including people with visual impairments?

of course not....   but neither did the OP or commenter use a statistically significant sample of people who would want it.

Everything so far as been individual or apocryphal commentary, with the exception of the post by gevv suggesting that "everyone" needs this.
 
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"Loki is not evil, although he is certainly not a force for good. Loki is... complicated."

FrizzleFried

Obviously the man was being hyperbolic when he said "Everyone young and old" but the fact remains... for some... it is small.  For me,  personally,  it was small originally but I've gotten used to it. 

Frankly... a reasonable adjustment in the Look/Layout wouldn't be a bad thing IMHO.  Even just two settings... "version 2.1 default" and "version 2.0 default" would probably suffice.

That said... I admit that I subscribe more to Arantors way of thinking.  The way I see things is that I would rather have a feature available to me that I do not use than one not available to me that I really want.  While I do understand the attraction to not offer everything in the world + the kitchen sink,  sometimes a bit of a compromise CAN be a good thing...

Now... what I'd love to see is a set of "official SMF" mods released that offers things like this perhaps, since there seems to be opposition to including it in the official release.  Perhaps something released at the same time you release an update (for example).  That would be one way to add functionality (officially) but without including it in the base install... no?

I know that some of the folks who work on the base software also release mods.... but I do not believe any of them are "Official SMF Expansion" type mods... right (correct me if I am wrong)?



Aleksi "Lex" Kilpinen

There are some official mods, but you are right there aren't many and I agree things like this would make for perfect official add ons IMO. But that also needs someone to code them, maintain them and support them, and sometimes that can be a bit of a hindrance.
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marcosbr


I increase the font/css since using 2.0.
90% of users asked for this!
All themes work fine!
No one else complained...
 
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Kindred

Quote from: FrizzleFried on May 06, 2022, 10:54:56 AMThat said... I admit that I subscribe more to Arantors way of thinking.  The way I see things is that I would rather have a feature available to me that I do not use than one not available to me that I really want.  While I do understand the attraction to not offer everything in the world + the kitchen sink,  sometimes a bit of a compromise CAN be a good thing...


the true irony of this statement is that Arantor is actually the main individual responsible for REMOVING many of the configuration options in 2.1  :D
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Please do not PM, IM or Email me with support questions.  You will get better and faster responses in the support boards.  Thank you.

"Loki is not evil, although he is certainly not a force for good. Loki is... complicated."

FrizzleFried

I can only speak for what he's expressed here.

 8)


Arantor

If you think those two sets of things are equivalent, you really didn't (and don't) understand what I was trying to do at all.

Having 1000 options is worse than having no options; having 10 options is better than having 100 if they're the right options.

And even I conceded that some of the choices were wrong in hindsight, and I did something about that, which is more than I can say for some.
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davo88

I vote for more control of fonts built right in to SMF.

The issue of having too many options can be overcome by better organisation of admin panels. Look at cPanel. It has a zillion options but they still manage to present a reasonably usable interface.

We want SMF to be popular and widely used. That means making it easy for admins to use, who can in turn make it easy for their forum members to use.
Typical forum end-users are not geeks. They barely know what the word "browser" refers to, let alone how to change the settings.

This forum is full of technically capable people. We are very different to the average forum user. We have to become more user oriented if we want to ensure SMF's longevity.

gevv

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Useful features, must be included in the core. I don't think you put a big load on the core (i'm not sure i don't know php :) )

Developers are very strict  ;D  O:)
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Antechinus

Ok, before this gets over the top: essentially, this is simple. The theme is already responsive. If the break points are set in em rather than in px, making the theme equally responsive for varying base font sizes becomes automatic. The layout will change at appropriate places depending on the base font size selected by the user.

In fact, I consider this such a no-brainer that I did it in Elk alpha immediately after that project split from SMF. It has worked right from the start. It would have done in it SMF 2.1 too, if there hadn't been a split.

So, all this really needs is one option to change the base font size on the html tag, and break points set in em. Simple. :P.
Sources code: making easy front end changes difficult since 1873 :P

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Arantor

Quote from: Antechinus on May 06, 2022, 04:47:34 PMdepending on the base font size selected by the user.

You are assuming the user knows how to do this. I only learned that browsers even had multiple font sizes from this topic - and I've been doing this stuff for literal decades at this point.

Given also how many people don't seem to know that Ctrl+scroll (or Ctrl+plus/Ctrl-minus) does zoom, why are we assuming they know how to change their browser?

Quote from: Antechinus on May 06, 2022, 04:47:34 PMIf the break points are set in em rather than in px

There you go, first project for the next version of SMF? Btw if you're planning on using GitHub for contributing, 2FA is going to be a requirement in future. (GitHub is making it mandatory for contributors to projects starting sometime next year.)
No good deed goes unpunished / All helpful urges should be circumvented

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Antechinus

Quote from: Arantor on May 06, 2022, 06:49:16 PM
Quote from: Antechinus on May 06, 2022, 04:47:34 PMdepending on the base font size selected by the user.

You are assuming the user knows how to do this.
I was assuming that, if the option was included in Profile > Look and Layout, at least some small percentage of users might be capable of finding it and using it. :P

Obviously this is touchingly naive faith in human nature on my part. I'm sweet and innocent like that.

QuoteI only learned that browsers even had multiple font sizes from this topic - and I've been doing this stuff for literal decades at this point.
Lol.

Quote
Quote from: Antechinus on May 06, 2022, 04:47:34 PMIf the break points are set in em rather than in px
There you go, first project for the next version of SMF?
Why wait that long? Custom theme FTW.

QuoteBtw if you're planning on using GitHub...
Lol.
Sources code: making easy front end changes difficult since 1873 :P

Mods & Themes | Revamped theme for this site | Dark theme for this site | GitHub for n00bz

marcosbr

It could be an option. Don't we have Curve 2 Color Changer?
Why not Curve2 Font Changer?
It would be an admin option...
The fear of editing the CSS would end and he would choose the size he thinks best!
I never accepted this: 
 
font: 83.33%/150% "Segoe UI", "Helvetica Neue", "Nimbus Sans L", Arial,
 "Liberation Sans", sans-serif;
 color: #4d4d4d;
 display: flex;
 flex-direction: column;
 min height: 100vh;

   I see little, things of age... 83.33%?
 What would blue be if everyone only likes white?
A MOD is an "option" only use who wants or needs it!
Nothing in life is absolute. We are always learning... Did you know that?
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Antechinus

Ok, true story, because it is hilariously funny in this context.

I bought a smartphone late last year. First one I've ever owned. So, a couple of months ago I was coding something for myself, and found the default font-size in Chrome on Android was a touch small for my preference if I set the CSS of my custom page to 100%.

Think to myself "OK, take a look at Chrome settings", because it does have this link called "Settings" in its standard little menu and I kinda figured that, y'know, something called "Settings" might possibly allow me to adjust some settings. Because, y'know, things called "Settings" usually do that, even on bloody Windows desktop.

Lo and behold, I find that Chrome on Android has a lovely little slider that lets you adjust the base font size in 5% intervals. In that respect, it is much more advanced and customisable than the desktop version of Chrome (which is basically a browser for kindergarten).

Short version: don't be so goddamned helpless. :P
Sources code: making easy front end changes difficult since 1873 :P

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Steve

Please do not PM me for support. 

Antechinus

Well, very occasionally I'm innocent, and I really can be quite sweet too. :D
But I admit those are not necessarily my default settings.
Sources code: making easy front end changes difficult since 1873 :P

Mods & Themes | Revamped theme for this site | Dark theme for this site | GitHub for n00bz

Antechinus

Quote from: Antechinus on May 06, 2022, 04:47:34 PMIf the break points are set in em rather than in px, making the theme equally responsive for varying base font sizes becomes automatic. The layout will change at appropriate places depending on the base font size selected by the user.

In fact, I consider this such a no-brainer that I did it in Elk alpha immediately after that project split from SMF. It has worked right from the start. It would have done in it SMF 2.1 too, if there hadn't been a split.
Just noting that apparently MDN have been recommending this for some time. No idea how long (I thought of it myself yonks ago) but MDN is definitely in favour of it now.

https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/CSS/@media#accessibility_concerns

QuoteAccessibility concerns

To best accommodate people who adjust a site's text size, use ems when you need a <length> for your media queries.

Both em and px are valid units, but em works better if the user changes the browser text size.

So there ya go. It's not just Ant going mental about trivia again. :D
Sources code: making easy front end changes difficult since 1873 :P

Mods & Themes | Revamped theme for this site | Dark theme for this site | GitHub for n00bz

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