Mambo & SMF Examples !?

[NoRad]

idigital - brilliant site. I'm very impressed. Thank you for the example.

tjay - you bring up a great point. SMF forums *can* be really busy and that's why I love the ability to theme them to your desire. When looking at SMF as a whole, I find that it really has all of the main/basic features covered, and with the themes ability and package manager I can integrate a lot of extras that might not come with a factory installation. SSI lets me use SMF content/features all over my site, allowing me to create my own "extra" pages while maintaining the same layout, design, and consistency.

What I've noticed while tinkering with Mambo is that it feels very clunky, like any other CMS I've worked with in the past (nuke variations, etc.)... I was able to get my SMF loaded into the Mambo and of course without modifying my SMF themes it looked like junk. Then I started looking around at the mambo features. Initially I wanted to investigate mambo for the purpose of having nicer profiles, blogging ability, better private messages, and most importantly the ability to link news articles on the homepage of the site that would then back-link to SMF forum posts.

Well... Their messaging system wasn't that great. The extended profiles feature didn't work by default (and I can extend them rather easily in SMF), and then we have the theme issues... I like having the ability for users to be able to skin my site, but Mambo didn't appear to want to talk nicely with SMF in this manner (same problem with coppermine, oh well).

When it's all said and done I don't really see any reason to use Mambo as opposed to writing a few custom pages with SSI that can do everything using SMF. I can (in theory) use SMF as a blogger. I can use it as a news posting machine and pull those items for the homepage, restricting the ability to post in that forum to moderators or news writers. It just really didn't see to add anything new, and in the end it's another problem to worry about when upgrading.

Most people appear to be using mambo to add some extra content to their site that uses SMF. What happened to writing some HTML in a PHP file, and using SSI? They aren't even utilizing the things mambo is supposed to be good for, and it's making their website look stupid (and busy).

* Radianation steps off soapbox.

[idigital]

Thanks

Yeah, it is true that people are either using SMF for a quick forum in their Mambo site, or using Mambo for some extra bits for SMF. But this has more to do with the partnership between the two being in it's early stages, and people not fully realising the potential of SSI and putting SMF features into Mambo and vice versa.

I think it will take a few months before there are good tips, tricks, SMF mods and Mambo modules and mambots to truly make full use of the two together.

For instance, once you have it bridged, there is nothing stopping some tricky hacking to allow any Mambo stuff within SMF or SMF stuff within Mambo. You could even hack the Mambo core to allow use of SMF user permissions (which isn't hard) or it's profiling.

I'm planning to create specialised SMF themes for Mambo, with custom hooks for a set of SMF "mambots" (mambo plugins) that will allow SMF to become much more a part of Mambo itself.

Basically, I think at this early point the only way to make the most of SMF + Mambo is to get down and dirty with the code, and SMF themes really allow this to be a lot easier than say hacking the Mambo core itself. SMF themes are truly a great way to create completely customised forums.

All that said, the SMF forum on RG is just a quick hack and some eye candy (even if it did take me a month)

In the meantime, as you say, there's nothing stopping anyone from creating quite good sites using SMF theming and SSI. You could probably even create some kind of simple content management system using SSI and content taken from forum posts. I think someone actually did create a simple CMS with SMF, or yabbse, possibly it was Compuart?

Anyway, undoubtedly SMF is a very powerful and easy to use forum s/w and Mambo is a very powerful and easy to use CMS. The two will become much more in the future

Cheers,

Damian

[NoRad]

I agree that down the road (hopefully) the two will become more integrated and more people will be able to offer tips and tricks. I still do not see what a CMS (mambo, or any other) can really offer somebody already using SMF? The Mambots and what not... What can they do to make a website better? Even on your site I don't see a lot of stuff that appears to be mambo-specific. It looks fairly static less the SMF aspect. A clever theme could just as easily make all of that happen. What are you using Mambo for?

[idigital]

What am I using Mambo for? Everything!

It's hell to update a content site by hand, so all of the review content is added in the backend on Mambo and dynamically inserted into the content. The reviews system, that is the scoring at the end of the reviews, I added into the Mambo code so it's easy for contributors to put in their scores for the game in the review editing area and it is dynamically displayed. The rating system for each game.

It's all based on a database, and I don't have the time to write something like that from scratch. Mambo, and any CMS, provides a modularity that is difficult to obtain without it.

Yeah, at the moment RG is still mostly eye candy, but eventually it will have full community features based around SMF+Mambo similar to the user toolbox IGN has and other big game sites.

The other thing that can be handy, which RG is not using yet, is the ability to let users submit content to the site from the frontend.

Really, Mambo is more of a web application framework that you can build anything on top of, but if you have the free time and determination you can of course code the same functionality from scratch in PHP.

Not me though

Cheers,

Damian

[NoRad]

I see, I guess that is a quick fix. What I'm thinking about doing is using specific forums kind of outside of the default SMF area (theme modification I suppose) that would be the NEWS on my site. The images would be attachments (with a modification to change where the default attachment is placed). The rating system would be a poll hack. Users could obviously reply to the news article and make a discussion... SSI has built in functions to include specific forum categories as "news" events on other pages. I don't see any reason for Mambo once again. Sorry =/

[tjay]

You most likely do not nee mambo.
What we are seeing here is the merging of two very different very good scripts. If you approach this from a forum > out position then SMF is apparently powerful enough that those with considerable knowlege of the script can build a CMS emulation built on a forum frame.
If you approach this from a CMS position, or in Mambos case a CMS/app framework then you can just as easily do without SMF and write your own forum IE simpleboard. In both cases you will end up with the same result
A powerful forum with content presentation management or
A great CMS with a built in forum
Both are workable and both are fine.
Many people choose mambo because it requires little knowledge of the core in order to get things done. Most of us, are not heavy coders. We are able to do things with Mambo and a little knowledge that we could not before.
Look at the number of products people are building for Mambo as a refrence. These are both comercial and non comercial projects.
As Mambo matures the components are getting more capable. For example. Look at facileforms.biz. Unitl 4.5.1 this type of powerful form building and even simpl applications development was not possible. In the next versions there will be more and more.
It sounds like SMF has built a hearty set of hooks and api that the SMF devotees are able to create solutions far beyond a forum. That is great. But could you put it in the hands of a new person and have them run with it??
Again this is somewhat a strange marriage, I can not speak to Ortismos vision or reason for providing the bridge. But many of us are here driven primarily by the need for  a heartier forum than simpleboard. Now having been here a while I see how all that SMF is makes it overkill for just another Mambo Forum.
Your search for a reason to use Mambo, may not exist. I needed a better forum, You may not need a better CMS.
It is all good. And I still think we have not yet seen the full potential of the marriage. But I suspect in time we will. There are too many creative people working on this from both ends now that the door has been opened.

Respectfully
TJay

[tjay]

Oh I am still very interested in sites that might represent the concept you are looking for. I am currently working on something for a kiteboarding site with the Mambo SMF combo, and hey most great ideas are ones built from the ideas of others

[NoRad]

Well, to be specific. I'm looking for something that has profiles and buddylists like Friendster, content on the homepage like any typical news site, and a forum backend that lets you tie everything together seamlessly.

If you look at my homepage, it's a very simple implementation of SSI from SMF. I've tried my best to integrate the forums with coppermine and a flashchat program. I just feel like I need something more. I was hoping that mambo would let me setup a platform so that down the road I can add new features to my site. I just haven't discovered those features or they do not exist.

So, for right now maybe I don't need Mambo. down the road I probably will. I want to know what lies "down the road" as a reason to make the switch now instead of later.

[tjay]

Well for profiles, you might want to look at the community builder component for Mambo. It allows you to set up custom profile fields, user groups and lists, integrate with MyPMS messaging system.
I have community builder on my test site, it is not anything to look at yet. I am still trying to stitch the pieces together myself.
I have managed to get SMF Mambo and Community builder to synch up using the SMF login.

To your point, tying the community builders profiling system to work more transparent with SMF and some sort of message system would be the bomb. ( I am not crazy about either Mambos or SMFs ) MyPMS is the best that I have found yet and I have considered paying for the pro version.
You can test that as well. I have hacked it on another site so that there is a graphic flashing light to alert the user their is a message. Still, I would love for that to be more robust.

There is a combination that will make the killer merge, and someone will come up with it.

[tjay]

By the way, have you had a look at www.mamboforge.net? that is where many of the add ons for Mambo can be found. I dont know to many people that use Mambo out of the box. It is but a frame for content mangement. The goodies come from the creative people making things that hang on the framework

[NoRad]

Yeah I've been to mamboforge and found it a headache to pour over all of the content. Is there an easy way to see what a specific addon does? I usually go to the top downloads and click around a bit. The only way I can figure it out is to download it and then read the text file...

[tjay]

Well there is Mamboportal.com
and also at corephp.com there is a try before you download of many components

oops
I just checked corephp, steve who does that site has it down adding a bunch of stuff

the older version still works and a lot of the new components are ports to the newer version

tbd 4.5 1.0.9 link

[NoRad]

While I don't want to get too far off topic, I still find the whole mambo admin interface overwhelming. I've been toying with it all day trying to just get a feel for it, and it just doesn't make sense. lol maybe I'm ignorant.

[tjay]

Nah just new to the interface. I get lost in the SMF admin too. I

[NoRad]

YAY! For anybody following along here that might have been thinking the way I did... I'm totally stoked about Mambo now. I made my first "static content" item and added it to the menu. It took me about 30 seconds to create a "clan roster page" for my gaming group. I was able to use HTML and simply link the names to their profile page. I now see what the hell you guys mean about CMS. I'll post my site once I have it integrated with Mambo. Hopefully, it will be what I've been "thinking of" all along.

[Orstio]

Radianation:  If you feel that the forum wrapped in Mambo looks too busy, you can also integrate just the registration and login.

[NoRad]

Radianation:  If you feel that the forum wrapped in Mambo looks too busy, you can also integrate just the registration and login.

Well, I think what I'm going to do is expand my Mambo theme so that it's 100% instead of fixed width. Then I'll strip down my SMF theme so that it fits nicely inside of the Mambo frame (providing consistency). Should I convert my Coppermine bridge from SMF to Mambo, and what do I need to do on the menu link in order for it to appear like SMF? Set it up as a wrapper? Maybe I'll make a new post. sry.

[Orstio]

Should I convert my Coppermine bridge from SMF to Mambo, and what do I need to do on the menu link in order for it to appear like SMF?

Unfortunately, there is no Mambo-Coppermine integration yet.

[xenovanis]

I'm thinking of installing coppermine, but I have a short question about the login integration.

I have mambo and smf integrated in one site, I used the bridge. I understand there is also a bridge for smf and coppermine login. Does that mean that (since registration, loggin in and out are managed by smf) users can login just once and don't need to login again for coppermine?

[tjay]

it does. works great