SMF: Pimped Edition

[Niteblade]

The Simple Machines Forum software stands on its own when compared against other php driven forum softwares. And while there are "more people" that know about the other forum sofwares, and therefore there exists more of a community to develop many more diverse modifications for the "other" softwares, SMF has some very talent modification makers in their own right.

With the impending introduction of SMF v1.1 Final, I realize that the development team has had their hands tied regarding the polishing and fine tuning of the Gold release. This in itself it quite a task. However, I think it would be interesting to have an "SMF: Pimped Edition."

After playing around with my imagination a little, the SMF: Pimped Edition would already include the most popular modifications for the forum software as voted on by the SMF community. In other words, I image a poll that asks, "Which modifications would you like to see in the SMF: Pimped edition?" Following this, each registered member of the SMF community would cast their votes for their favorite modifications.

One reason for this line of thinking is that after installing several modifications though the package manager, it becomes quite a task to un-install (and upgrade) one particular mod without breaking others. In order to made upgrading or unstalling modifications as easy as possible, I'm proposing that the forum software itself already have the modification coding inside of it.

I know that there are several objections to this line of thinking. The development team's ultimate goal is to keep their software error-free and efficient, first and foremost. Therefore, there would be the objection of time: It would be impossible to design a stable forum software with dozens of modifications. Another objection would be in terms of copyright. Where should "credit" for a particular modification be displayed? One more objection would be in terms of use. Some administrators do not want to use some of the modifications available and would feel that the stream-lined software would introduce uncessary delays in page rendering. The final objection, in my mind, comes in terms of security. The SMF team does not want to assume responsibility for poorly coded modifications, or for modifications that would introduce a security hole in their forum software.

With these objections in mind, however, the need to have a flexible package manager that makes it possible to upgrade, install, or un-install modifications with ease comes to mind. I believe that there should be some kind of "Modifications Management" menu whereby particular modifications can be switched on/off without disrupting the other modifications that are installed -- (In essence, this IS the package manager). In other words, by proposing the SMF: Pimped edition, I was proposing a new approach to modification management. The Pimped edition, by including many, if not all, possible modifications, would facilitate this process. In future releases or upgrades, the modification author would simply search for his or her particular modification code and change their code alone without worrying about affecting other modifications or the core SMF programming itself.

I'm not attempting to start a controvery here. Nor am I pretending to be a programmer. I'm just one guy who likes SMF, who uses SMF, and who wants to see SMF grow even more. If anything, my lack of programming knowledge shined forth in what I've written. To desire a SMF version that has a lot of modifications already installed speaks to my frustrations of figuring out why the modification would not install. My desire to un-install or upgrade particular modifications would affecting others speaks to the frustrations that I have had when the package manager throws up an error during this process. Granted, I learned a lot during these troubleshooting processes.

I suppose if I had to summarize what I've already said, "Is there any way to design SMF to be more modification friendly?"

[Panzer-]

Compare modding SMF to the likes of phpBB or IPB 1.3.1 . Installing a mod on SMF takes a mere 1-3 minutes. Installing mods IPB 1.3.1 and phpBB can take up to an hour. Per Mod!

I think the SMF developers have done a great job making SMF very user friendly. I honestly dont see the point in a premodded or pimped edition. Its just as easy to install the mod yourself. Mod authors will feel ripped off, there was a big outcry on the phpBB forums from the mod authors about premods like phpbb plus, they didnt really acknowledege the author. You didnt have to go to the mod database and see who made the mod and download it, it was already there.

I dont think there should be a premod or pimped edition. Just click download mod > install  mod > apply mod > refresh your self.

[Niteblade]

That's cool.

I was just trying to say that in order to install and/or upgrade an existing mod, you've got to learn a bit of PHP. I suppose that in addition to forum administration, an admin must be able to correct code by hand -- and the current SMF mod system forces all noobies to learn. (SMF demands that everyone be a little bit of a programmer.) However, judging by the many replies to the mods (See the Mod Board), I get the feeling that most people find the current system troublesome.

Examples:

• "This Mod doesn't work."
• "This Mod broke my forum."
• "This Mod errors out through the Package manager." Common Reply: -> "Open up the .XML and install by hand."
• "What if I wanted this Mod to do X, Y, or Z as well?"

I'm 99.99% certain that there will never, ever, be a SMF: Pimped edition. But in light of the number of questions about modification installation, perhaps something can be done? I was just brainstorming about "what" could be done. The alternative is to keep things as they are, demand that everyone learn a little bit of PHP, and possibily alienate those who can't/won't learn a little PHP.

Do you think an SMF Developer will say, "We don't need people who are ignorant in PHP programming to use our software. Use something else."

[GiNi3D]

Do you think an SMF Developer will say, "We don't need people who are ignorant in PHP programming to use our software. Use something else."

Actually it's weird, because SMF in part was based on that idea, to get users that don't understand PHP at all. Go see elsewhere if other boards installs as easily as SMF, go see if other boards can manage mods like SMF, go see how well and clear the coding is... install them all and compare them to SMF, then come back. You will see how SMF already gives you the golden platter.

You already have the best, improvements, sure there will be, and better it will be too. 

[drswift]

installing mods on SMF is the easiest.

However it doesn't take an hour to install them on phpbb2. Simply install EasyMOD and you can do many many of the mods in a minute or so.

SMF is mainly easiest because of the indexing, sourcing etc of the package manager.

ps - does anyone know how to convert phpbb themes? or is this impossable?

[Plaka]

I'm new to SMF ... a long time ago I used YABB, not SE and was amazed at the changes in SMF it was a breeze to install!

Now to add to your "Pimped" version idea: there was something similiar with the old YABB and it was quite popular in fact, so there's obviously a requirement for it.

The package Manager feature is designed to take all the hard work out of installing Mods and you can even browse on-line the mods available. Problems arise when you try to install a Mod that hasn't yet been updated which I found out today.

So in conclusion if you can get approval for this from the Dev Team then I say go ahead people will always opt for a fully tricked out version if it's available. Personally I like the hands-on approach and prefer to add as I like rather than have it packaged for me.

Good luck
Plaka.

[Elmacik]

DEV team wont approve such a thing. Because mods arent created by the DEV team.
So DEVs cannot guarantee what people will face up when they used "pimped edition" and they cannot give support through it. Because some parts actually wont belong to them.
Additionally, having a heavily moded forum doesnt mean a good thing.
It means more vulnerable forum and possibly more mess codes.

[drswift]

Is SMF not open source? if so could a user group not concievably create such a 'pimped up' version themselves? That way the Dev team don't need to worry about it?

[Elmacik]

Yes, right. But its not permitted to release.
Everyone can make his/her own "edition" of SMF very freely, but he/she cannot release/redistribute it to anyone.
SMF is open source yes, but redistribution and altering of license are not allowed.

[Harzem]

Is SMF not open source? if so could a user group not concievably create such a 'pimped up' version themselves? That way the Dev team don't need to worry about it?

In the meaning of GPL/GNU, no, SMF is not open source.

SMF is free to install, use,
free to modify and use
but not free to redistribute, so it is not GPL.