I know SMF 2 started around Jan 2006 and I'm begging to loose trust in SMF now because of all the bugs we've been left with. 

Do they plan on releasing RC2 this year ?

Can we expect a final this century ?

Is their life on mars ??

Update on development progress: SMF Dev Blog #42: The Blog About Life, The Universe And Everything

Bugs in SMF 2.0? I don't think so... Sure there might be issues here and there, but for the most part, SMF 2.0 RC1 is pretty good. I use it on my public site. It may not be super popular, but no one has ever reported major issues which have seriously damaged anything or anyone in any way

SMF 2.0 is anything but abandoned... which is what you seem to think/state SMF 2.0 is. SMF is free, and is right up there with other paid forums, and it takes time to produce quality code. While I am not part of the SMF team in any way, I am quite sure the team is always working on SMF in some way. I wouldn't be surprised if they converse with one another to decide how ready SMF 2.0 RC2 is.

Quote from: Arantor on July 02, 2009, 10:25:44 AM
Considering how much rewrite went into 2.0, and it's surprisingly bug free for a release candidate - but that is what it is - a release candidate, not a final. You can't expect an RC to be bug free.

I have to keep telling people to use another browser because 2.0 doesn't like IE so I don't call that a minor issue which are the sort of problems an RC should have

Quote from: Arantor on July 02, 2009, 10:25:44 AM
Most software is either shipped late, or on time with bugs. Or worse: late AND with bugs. Vista was about 3 years late, by the way. Also remember that the developers don't get paid for working on SMF, it's all done by volunteers.

Vista worked from scratch, the only difference is it was improved.  Also trying to compare vista (50 million lines of code) with SMF is silly to say the least.

Quote from: Arantor on July 02, 2009, 10:25:44 AM
And considering that for RC2 there is not only bug fixing but a complete new default theme that is a *complete* rewrite of the existing theme (which is a huge, huge task in itself, since it's every theme file to be rewritten from scratch), it's hardly surprising that it's running a little late. But it's worth waiting for.

Yes changing the way the theme works on beta 4 was a great plan, doesn't that normally happen on a alpha

Quote from: Arantor on July 02, 2009, 10:25:44 AM
If you want to change, please do so, but find another forum that has the power, overall stability, featureset and performance of SMF without paying for it.

You mean like mybb ?

Quote from: riker on July 03, 2009, 03:22:18 AM
I have to keep telling people to use another browser because 2.0 doesn't like IE so I don't call that a minor issue which are the sort of problems an RC should have

Maybe one of the more important questions are you using a custom theme, if so, then that is what could have the problems in IE and as such is totally unrelated to any bugs that RC1 has, Core works perfectly fine in IE.

Quote from: Gazmanafc on July 03, 2009, 05:35:58 AM

Quote from: riker on July 03, 2009, 03:22:18 AM
I have to keep telling people to use another browser because 2.0 doesn't like IE so I don't call that a minor issue which are the sort of problems an RC should have

Maybe one of the more important questions are you using a custom theme, if so, then that is what could have the problems in IE and as such is totally unrelated to any bugs that RC1 has, Core works perfectly fine in IE.

Jep, haven't had problems with IE and RC1, except certain IE8 related (small) problems...

Well let me remind you of a certain important line on the downloads page for 2.0RC1

QuoteNote: As this is in early beta we do not suggest running SMF 2.0 RC1.1 on a production site.

If you have an important site stick with 1.1.9 on the live site until you iron out bugs relevant to your intended 2.0 setup.The warning is there but if you take no notice then you cant come blaming the dev's for a site not being right.If you think you can debug and code the final release faster than them feel free to upload a copy of it for them here. [/]

The problem at the moment is that although Core works it is very finely tuned, so when making custom themes you can break things in areas you never even touched, and not just in IE8 either. I've seen that happen a lot and it can be a real pain to fix. Basically Core works as long as you don't touch anything or breathe too heavily.  

If you want to go back to SMF 1.1.9, you certainly can... It just takes a bit.

I have heard of people converting to another forum system which has a SMF 2.0 RC1-1 converter, but of course you need to be sure that forum system has a converter from them to SMF.

It might be a bit of a hassle, but it can be done (and has been). But of course, things such as permissions, groups, avatars, and so on might be lost or screwed up in the transitions.

Quote from: Arantor on July 03, 2009, 05:27:25 AM
No, as far as I know the theme was not that hugely changed. Wasn't Curve announced after RC 1?

I was told it would be implimented on RC however the change from PHP to HTML theming was done on BETA4!

Quote from: Arantor on July 03, 2009, 05:27:25 AM
As for MyBB, go for it. If it serves your needs, use it. No-one asked you or forced you to use SMF, and definitely not any of that for 2.0. You were advised that it may have issues, but even 1.1.x is easily comparable to many other systems.

Agreed, it was my fault for trusting SMF and moving to SMF 2.0

Quote from: Gazmanafc on July 03, 2009, 05:35:58 AM

Quote from: riker on July 03, 2009, 03:22:18 AM
I have to keep telling people to use another browser because 2.0 doesn't like IE so I don't call that a minor issue which are the sort of problems an RC should have

Maybe one of the more important questions are you using a custom theme, if so, then that is what could have the problems in IE and as such is totally unrelated to any bugs that RC1 has, Core works perfectly fine in IE.

No I use the default theme so I plug-ins are easier to install and the problems I've had are confirmed problems with SMF.

Quote from: Gazmanafc on July 03, 2009, 05:35:58 AM
Core works perfectly fine in IE.

Oh, you should tell your dev team the setup you use then because they've been working on fixes!

Quote from: nightbre on July 03, 2009, 05:57:20 AM
Well let me remind you of a certain important line on the downloads page for 2.0RC1

QuoteNote: As this is in early beta we do not suggest running SMF 2.0 RC1.1 on a production site.

Nice, just one thing nightbre, it's not a beta, it's release candidate

Quote from: riker on July 03, 2009, 10:53:06 AM
I was told it would be implimented on RC however the change from PHP to HTML theming was done on BETA4!

You're getting yourself mixed up. The themes have always been coded in PHP and HTML, you mean the change from tabled layouts to semantic layouts, where tables are removed in favour of a more CSS orientated format.

Quote from: riker on July 03, 2009, 03:22:18 AM
No I use the default theme so I plug-ins are easier to install and the problems I've had are confirmed problems with SMF.

Link me to your site. I want to see these errors you're getting reported myself. Have you even bothered to consider in asking us how to fix them rather than just saying all this stuff. We're here to help you know. I did a test this morning using the RC1-1 release on the site, and it loaded perfectly fine, with zero mods, so if any errors are occurring, it's no doubt because of a mod, and not SMF itself.

Quote from: riker on July 03, 2009, 10:55:57 AM
Nice, just one thing nightbre, it's not a beta, it's release candidate

Even RC's are referred to as beta usage.

Quote from: Gazmanafc on July 03, 2009, 11:40:18 AM
You're getting yourself mixed up. The themes have always been coded in PHP and HTML, you mean the change from tabled layouts to semantic layouts, where tables are removed in favour of a more CSS orientated format.

Well it was phrased to me like I said

Quote from: Gazmanafc on July 03, 2009, 11:40:18 AMLink me to your site. I want to see these errors you're getting reported myself. Have you even bothered to consider in asking us how to fix them rather than just saying all this stuff. We're here to help you know. I did a test this morning using the RC1-1 release on the site, and it loaded perfectly fine, with zero mods, so if any errors are occurring, it's no doubt because of a mod, and not SMF itself.

I have reported them and the dev team have been good in getting back to be and admitting their problems.  The problem is though we'll only end up seeing these fixes in RC2

Also the problems reported are regarding IE7/8 (yes I said 7) on PM's and certain areas of the admincp where I have to switch browsers.

http://dev.simplemachines.org/mantis/view.php?id=3304

http://dev.simplemachines.org/mantis/view.php?id=3354#c8564

I should add the latest (2 days ago) one to complain about the PM problem was using IE6 on XP so the theme change on beta4 screwed up more than you think.

Quote from: riker on July 03, 2009, 10:55:57 AM
Even RC's are referred to as beta usage.

QuoteRelease candidate
The term release candidate (RC) refers to a version with potential to be a final product, ready to release unless fatal bugs emerge. In this stage of product stabilization (read QA cycle), all product features have been designed, coded and tested through one or more Beta cycles with no known showstopper-class bug.

Yeah... and? RC1 was released because no known showstopping bugs were found.

The reason for the RC is to be one step closer to going gold (v2 final)... But they don't want to do that incase any more bugs are found, which still includes showstopping bugs.

@riker has got a point there, about the duration of the 2.0 version. Let us all be realistic, it has gone on for much too long then it was supposed. And if from one beta to another beta and from one rc version to another it has taken at least 6 months, then it will hit the final version at the end of this year or even early next year. That is if no other rc comes in between

I love Smf but let us call things as they are.  I have seen plenty of people that have lost patience like riker and have switched away to other forums. Just my 2 $

Quote from: babjusi on July 03, 2009, 02:23:31 PM
I love Smf but let us call things as they are.  I have seen plenty of people that have lost patience like riker and have switched away to other forums. Just my 2 $

I honestly can not understand that - because I am perfectly happy using 1.1.9 still. And I will be using it until 2.0 comes out final.
If no one ever mentioned about 2.0, everyone would still probably just as ready to use 1.1.9 as I am, as it still compares nicely to many of it's rivals...

( And gosh, some people even use the 1.0 branch of SMF still )

Just my 2c.

I can understand why it is people would get annoyed, but as stated many times, you are warned about the possibilities of issues in SMF 2.0.

Also, personally, I don't think SMF 2.0 has taken too long. Yes, it has been awhile, but if you want a quality product, you need to give it time. Everyone on the SMF dev team does this in their free time, and for free. I know that cannot be used as an excuse EVERY time, but you still need to consider that. The SMF team could have released SMF 2.0 final a long time ago... They really could have, but they choose not to because that would affect their reputation and people would always remember that the SMF team releases final versions of software which is ridden with horrible and crippling bugs... But SMF doesn't want that

Quote from: aldo on July 03, 2009, 02:12:10 PM
Yeah... and? RC1 was released because no known showstopping bugs were found.

Are you being serous?.  I've got respect for the dev team because they've always got back to me when I've reporting problems but the theme issues on beta4 were huge.  How the beta testers missed them is just beyond me.  I think if you had decent beta testers then RC would not be here now because we'd be on beta5

Quote from: LexArma on July 03, 2009, 02:32:06 PM

( And gosh, some people even use the 1.0 branch of SMF still )

Just my 2c.

Some people use IPB 1.3 too because it still has lots of features but how old is that and how old is SMF 2.0 ?

I guess you won't be convinced no matter what we say. But all good quality software takes time to mature. phpBB hasn't managed that yet...

It's nothing to do with being convinced or brainwashed for that matter.  It's about what we know and seen with our own eyes